There are some other markings I did not notice before. There is a yellow paint marking highlighting the other marks. They appear to be a fomoco logo with either 32 or 82 above it. Any clue??

Does this info tell you anything about what the cam is?

Those markings do not mean anything to me.  Reverse engineering the camshaft specs either by using a Cam Doctor or measuring the camshaft lobe profiles within an engine would tell more about the camshaft at this point.  If I could borrow the camshaft, I would be interested in reverse engineering the specs from it.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)

.I recently bought a 57 E-code t-bird. I now have reason to believe it is the 285HP version. It has dual valve springs, dual points in the distributor and absolutely none of the options normally found on T-birds. No power anything. No convertible top or port holes, nothing but a radio. I fellow in PA who owns 30 T-Birds believes this is what is called a "street racer"? I found the car by talking to a paint salesman that used to ride in it in high school. His buddy's father was the original owner. The car developed a flat cam and was parked on Vashon Island WA in the salt air for 51 years. Needless to say it is a mess, but it is all there and has never been rebuilt. They did repaint the hood though due to all the stack fires they had.  I will be rebuilding this engine in the winter time and will see just what the cam is like. I have also ordered the original factory invoice in hopes it sheds some light on the 285HP issue. Will this help shed any light on the subject?

Hello Robin

Welcome to the Y Blocks Forever site!

You really have really jumped into the deep end of the pool with your first post as this has been one of the hottest and most confusing topics ever discussed.

I"m sure you read thru this thread before writing so you already know that as of now there has been NO Ford information availiable on this engine (except to acknowledge that it does exist)

My suggestion to you is on teardown of the engine please send the camshaft out for diagnosis.
Myself,Ted Eaton,or John Mummert would be the best folks to give you straight answers on what you have.Even a wiped cam can yield volumes of information.

Since there is no information regarding your location on the planet its hard to say who would be closest to you to send the cam to for analysis.

I"m in Maryland, Ted in Texas, and Mummert in Calif.

You should also inspect your distributor and let us know what the casting numbers are . If is is a correct "E" code distributor then the dual point system was an addition.
Normal "E" code machines only used a single set of points.

 Dual points being used in the 285 H.P. engine have not been discussed but would have been a period correct way to gain some ignition system stability - perhaps you have taken this discussion on a different path.

The "F" code (supercharged) engines used a factory dual point setup as did some of the other speciality race engines of the era (Mercury for one).

The dual valve springs may indicate a 285 engine , however there was a Ford Service Bulletin modification that offered the dual springs as an upgrade on any of the "E" Code engines. Yours may have gone thru that upgrade after it was in use for awhile.

Your "gate sheet" release sheet would be of interest if it actually is a 285 engine. To date nothing has been found on that subject either.
 As I previously said - this is a mysterious topic.

I will add that since the 285 engine builds were discontinued in December of 56 - IF you have a 285 H.P. engine the build date of your car would be sometime from Dec of 56 to perhaps as late as early in March of 57.  And even thats a guess !
 
It is also believed that the 285 engines exclusively used the oval style air cleaners. What style of air cleaner is on your car?

I"m sure others will chime in but thanks for posting up and letting us know that there are people still interested in 60 year old race machines.
We look forward to whatever information you can add.

Oldmics

The fellow that used to ride around in this car in high school (mid sixties) doesn't think the engine was ever messed with. In other words, he thinks it is all original. It is doubtful that the original owner had anything modified at the dealers, but maybe the original invoice will shed some light on it. There are the siblings that I bought the car from, so I will ask their opinion too if they can remember anything. I am located in Arlington Wa.  I will be happy to send the cam out for inspection. It needs to be rebuilt as that was the reason the car was parked in 1966 never to run again.

Here is what Tom Stocks from CTCI had to say about the car.The vin indicate your car was the 539th unit (E-Bird) built in late Feb 1957 and is confirmed with the data plate.   It was also shipped direct to Seattle and if  the owner who passed was the original owner and the car was put in storage upon his passing it could well be one of he 285 hp cars.  I would be very interested in seeing a copy of the invoice when you get it and see if is or if the invoice can shed some light on if the company did code it as receiving the285 hp equipment.  I am forwarding this to Gil our authenticity chairman,I believe he would be interested in this car.
The air cleaner is the normal E-Code air cleaner except very rusty. I attached a photo of it. Financially, doing the resurrecting of this car makes little sense, but if it really is a 285hp car, that gives me more of a reason to do it right.

Robin.  Welcome to the web site.

Oldmics has done a good job of responding to your first posting.

Following up on the dual point distributor and having the camshaft checked for its specs are things I hope you will do.

One long time 'Bird owner here in Syracuse did a lot of digging on the E and F code engines back in the early 1970 when he was doing a body off restoration on an E code 'Bird.  From his research, he believed that the hi-po E code had both dual valve springs, the super charged cam, and a dual point distributor. 

At that time, he was able to order all of the components that he believed were the parts used by Ford to assemble the hi-po version of the E code.  The components he ordered from Ford over a Syracuse parts counter were:  two piece valve springs, one piece valve spring retainers, a supercharged engine camshaft, the F code engine dual point distributor plate, the F code distributor cam,  the F code distributor advance springs, and the F code ignition distributor vacuum chamber.

As Oldmics has indicated, many on this Forum and those affiliated with the Classic Thunderbird Club International would greatly appreciate any definitive information you are able to glean about the engine you have in the 'Bird you have purchased.

I hope that the person who disassembles your y-block is well versed in them.  As Oldmics has suggested, there is much information to be gained from the defective camshaft and from the components in the ignition distributor.  The validity of what is learned will be supported by the care with which other engine parts are looked at for their originality pedigree.  Some engine parts like engine bearings, cylinder heads, and engine blocks have date codes that reflect when they were produced.  Individuals well versed in the E code dual quad set-ups will tell you that there were variations in components like throttle linkage and air cleaner housings depending upon when they were produced during or after the '57 model year concluded in early December of 1957.

Oldmics suggestions of your turning to Ted Eaton, John Mummert, or John Harding to check the camshaft specs are all excellent, reputable y-block individuals to do the work.

NoShortcuts
a.k.a. Charlie Brown
near Syracuse, New York

a list of casting dates on block, intake, heads and other components would be good information for all to know also! Great find and appreciate your respect and restoration of it.

55 Vicky & customline

58 Rack Dump, 55 F350 yard truck, 57 F100

59 & 61 P 400's, 58 F100 custom cab, 69 F100, 79 F150, 82 F600 ramp truck, 90 mustang conv 7 up, 94 Mustang, Should I continue?

Robin.  I'm still thinking about what you may have purchased.

Properly forensically disassembled and cataloged, you will have perhaps THE first credible information in existence regarding the supposed hi-po Ford  '57 E code engine and it's component parts.

WHO you choose to do the disassembly of your engine AND the completeness and detail of the recording of the information determined will be pivotal to how the information is respected and valued and the potential collector value of your restored car.

Food for thought . . .  


NoShortcuts
a.k.a. Charlie Brown
near Syracuse, New York

I never thought that this car would be able to solve a mystery of such proportions. I am really excited to help all the T-Bird fans finally put some of these 285HP questions to bed.
Bob Quarterman, one of our mechanical engineers builds and races cars as his passion. He only works to support his racing habit. Bob will be doing the rebuild on this engine as he has a lifetime of experience on it. He is not all that familiar with Y blocks though. We will make sure we document everything and will send any pertinent parts out to the real experts for evaluation and rebuilding. We know the cam is worn out. That is why the car was parked in 1966. It has not run since. I think the original owner got tired of repainting the hood due to stack fires. I have noted all the comments so far and will comply with all the advice and concerns as far as documenting everything. I will be glad to share it all here as it happens. I do not expect to be removing the engine until this winter, but we may be able to get some info on the heads, intake manifold, distributor and such before.
I am not able to tell if the air cleaner housing was originally painted or chromed? Too many fires? The engine does have a chrome oil filler cap. Doesn't that indicate a dress up kit was part of the engine? It find it hard to believe this air cleaner was ever chrome plated though. That will be a lot of fun restoring. Like a lot of the car, it is in pretty bad shape. I will attach a few pictures here of the distributor and valve springs. I do not yet understand the single part valve spring retainer? Maybe these pictures will help you determine if that is what we have?
I do not always remember to go to this forum as my schedule is too busy. I do always answer regular e-mails though so if anyone wants to get info regarding this car quicker, feel free to e-mail me directly. robin@midnitesolar.com