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292 Y block with dual quad carter carbs stalls when trans is shifted in neutral.

Posted By Joe D 6 Years Ago
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292 Y block with dual quad carter carbs stalls when trans is shifted...

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miker
Posted 6 Years Ago
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I’m not sure either of these will apply to you, but it’s my experience and involved stalling engines.

I had a fine Moroso fuel filter installed at the rear before the electric pump. New fuel tank, but I got a bad tank of gas. It would plug up while driving, then restart a minute later. I limped home and pulled it, it was full of very fine particles. I replaced it with an oem style filter and solved the problem. I was told the fine filter should have a coarser filter in front on the suction side, and then be pressurized. And the racers clean them between every run. You mentioned you just installed one.

I had a very similar hot/driving problem to yours on a car I move to a new location. Hot day, from sea level to 2600 ft., it loaded up and died. I thought to was vapor lock, but it restarted at full throttle. The local speed shop guys said “it’s the attitude change and the pressure regulator. Either put a gauge on it and reset the pressure, or try lowering the float level just a bit”. Since it was a Holley, I pulled the sight plugs and took it down I/2 turn on the external adjustment. Problem solved. When I can get it on a hoist and get to the regulator I’ll do it right. But this is a boost referenced blow thru supercharged motor. So it could be the increase in temp is affecting the pressure and that’s where the flooding is coming from. I don’t know.

miker
55 bird, 32 cabrio F code
Kent, WA
Tucson, AZ
Joe D
Posted 6 Years Ago
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KULTULZ (10/26/2018)
"Having trouble ID ing these Carter 4 barrel carbs. No tags and markings around base that I can find"

Without the ASSEMBLY ID TAG(S), identification is going to be difficult as kits, parts and specs will vary between car makes.

.http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm

I'll attach an interpretation chart a little later.

https://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/31/vacumm-reading-1-752x1024.png

By any chance, can you see any CASTING ID NOS. on the actual intake manifold? 

"Coolant temperature around 180 degrees and confirmed with a digital heat gun. I also tried insulating pressure side lines up to the carbs and still stalled. I do think its an inside carb issue."

Don't forget ethanol blended gasoline has a much lower boiling point. Shoot the thermometer at that braided fuel line after driving for a while. It is sitting in direct airflow from a hot radiator. Also try to get an engine compartment temp reading. Usually, fuel bowl percolation happens after shutdown and resultant engine heat soak, causing the fuel to boil out of the bowl vents. Much heat is also picked up @ the mechanical fuel pump as it is attached to the engine directly.

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/7fe432d6-72d1-4e1c-978c-29ca.jpg

You do have a filter before the carbs?

No, I removed the fine brass screens that were in the carb inlet ports. It didn't help but I left them out for now. 

Wish I would get my act together ...

The reason for the vacuum gauge is to insure the engine is tight. Some leaks manifest themselves once the engine is hot and things begin to expand.




Joe D (The Frig)
1960 F-100 - 292 Y-Block
Philly Burbs
Joe D
Posted 6 Years Ago
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KULTULZ (10/26/2018)
"Having trouble ID ing these Carter 4 barrel carbs. No tags and markings around base that I can find"

Without the ASSEMBLY ID TAG(S), identification is going to be difficult as kits, parts and specs will vary between car makes.

.http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm

I'll attach an interpretation chart a little later.

https://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/31/vacumm-reading-1-752x1024.png

By any chance, can you see any CASTING ID NOS. on the actual intake manifold? 

"Coolant temperature around 180 degrees and confirmed with a digital heat gun. I also tried insulating pressure side lines up to the carbs and still stalled. I do think its an inside carb issue."

Don't forget ethanol blended gasoline has a much lower boiling point. Shoot the thermometer at that braided fuel line after driving for a while. It is sitting in direct airflow from a hot radiator. Also try to get an engine compartment temp reading. Usually, fuel bowl percolation happens after shutdown and resultant engine heat soak, causing the fuel to boil out of the bowl vents. Much heat is also picked up @ the mechanical fuel pump as it is attached to the engine directly.

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/7fe432d6-72d1-4e1c-978c-29ca.jpg

You do have a filter before the carbs?

Wish I would get my act together ...

The reason for the vacuum gauge is to insure the engine is tight. Some leaks manifest themselves once the engine is hot and things begin to expand.
I removed the fine brass screens that were in the carb inlet ports.



Joe D (The Frig)
1960 F-100 - 292 Y-Block
Philly Burbs
Joe D
Posted 6 Years Ago
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I removed the fine brass screens that were in the carb ports.
KULTULZ (10/26/2018)
"Having trouble ID ing these Carter 4 barrel carbs. No tags and markings around base that I can find"

Without the ASSEMBLY ID TAG(S), identification is going to be difficult as kits, parts and specs will vary between car makes.

.http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm

I'll attach an interpretation chart a little later.

https://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/31/vacumm-reading-1-752x1024.png

By any chance, can you see any CASTING ID NOS. on the actual intake manifold? 

"Coolant temperature around 180 degrees and confirmed with a digital heat gun. I also tried insulating pressure side lines up to the carbs and still stalled. I do think its an inside carb issue."

Don't forget ethanol blended gasoline has a much lower boiling point. Shoot the thermometer at that braided fuel line after driving for a while. It is sitting in direct airflow from a hot radiator. Also try to get an engine compartment temp reading. Usually, fuel bowl percolation happens after shutdown and resultant engine heat soak, causing the fuel to boil out of the bowl vents. Much heat is also picked up @ the mechanical fuel pump as it is attached to the engine directly.

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/7fe432d6-72d1-4e1c-978c-29ca.jpg

You do have a filter before the carbs?

Wish I would get my act together ...

The reason for the vacuum gauge is to insure the engine is tight. Some leaks manifest themselves once the engine is hot and things begin to expand.




Joe D (The Frig)
1960 F-100 - 292 Y-Block
Philly Burbs
Joe D
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Ok tonight I drove the truck and it took awhile to make it stall because it was cool outside (52 degrees). After getting it to stall I pulled off the side of the road and checked the carbs:

I look into the carbs and saw some cloudy vapors. When I pulled back on the throttle gas did squirt in the back carb and then the front carb. I also checked the exhaust and it didn't smell like gas.

I'm going to get a tank full of ethanol free gas and see what happens. Stay tuned!

Thanks for all the help,

Joe D

Joe D (The Frig)
1960 F-100 - 292 Y-Block
Philly Burbs
KULTULZ
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Posted 6 Years Ago
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At the minimum, reinstall those screens. You have no particulate protection as the 10 micron inline filter @ the tank acts as a sock filter (as on later applications) and only catches boulders and JAP midget submarines (but it is useful).

When it shut down, did you check for spark also? The condensers coming through now are junk. Once they cool a little, the engine will fire right up.

Also on a possible vacuum leak. When this occurs it will lean out the fuel mixture at that point.



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Joe D
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I did not check spark but it always starts back up. I will pull a plug sometime to see if it is wet. Delaying that maneuver since they are hard to get at and those headers are hot!

Ok I will reinstall the fine mesh screens.

I don't have a condenser. I have PerTronix electronic points remember?

Hunting down these ethanol free gas stations. Hopefully it will stop raining someday in Pa!

Thanks again!!
 

Joe D (The Frig)
1960 F-100 - 292 Y-Block
Philly Burbs
Joe D
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Oh, I also checked for vacuum leaks around carbs by spraying  carbs while running with carb cleaner and found nothing yet.






Joe D (The Frig)
1960 F-100 - 292 Y-Block
Philly Burbs
KULTULZ
Posted 6 Years Ago
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"I don't have a condenser. I have PerTronix electronic points remember?"

And I am an old fart that has advanced CRS. Please remember that... BigGrin

Do you know if you have the IGNITOR I or II?

If you cannot determine a vacuum leak at the actual occurrence timing, you will most likely have an internal carb(s) problem.

Say your intake is not torqued down properly, it may induce a vacuum leak at a certain temp as it is allowed to move. Just something to think about. You need to buy (IMO) a combination vacuum/fuel pressure gauge ($20) just to verify engine condition and tune.

Did you kit the carbs at install or were they ready to go?



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GREENBIRD56
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Just opened this to check on progress ...... there is an ancient thread that explains an old problem with the Pertronics being grounded properly. The factory braided copper jumper from the point plate to the dizzy housing must remain effective - and the dizzy must ground effectively to the block. Otherwise the voltage to the little black box doesn't stay at the appointed level. Probably not the case here...

What idle speed are you maintaining with this outfit? Will raising it impact the problem? My bird will go clear down to 450 without too much trouble (factory cam and Demon carb) - but not a good idea with the auto trans in drive. Sounds like your idle drops too low when the temp is up at operating temperature.

Fuel pump may need to be thumping along a little quicker to draw sufficient suction. On my outfit I chose to put a pressurized canister style filter on the carb side - not the tank line.

How do you have the carbs rigged for idle? Front closed and idle off the rear - or what operational scheme is in play here? If you have a GM carb set-up (Corvette or Caddy) this may make a difference. I believe there were Carters on the Mercury engine but I know little about them. 



http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/9ea2bf28-00c4-4772-9ac7-d154.jpg 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona


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