Profile Picture

1957 and up distributors

Posted By monarch 9 Years Ago
You don't have permission to rate!
Author
Message
KULTULZ
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 2 days ago
Posts: 1.8K, Visits: 306.3K
Ted (6/7/2008)
DANIEL TINDER (6/4/2008)
Ted,

I located and reread the excerpt on pump shafts from "Engine Builder's Handbook", by Tom Monroe. I had remembered incorrectly, as it was NOT cam gear wear that he was concerned with, but shaft breakage due to increased shock loading of the ends (which are still the same size, though the shaft itself is larger and less flexible).

Glad to hear your experience with heavier, after-market shafts has been positive. I will thus feel more secure in using the one I have for my grocery-getter rebuild. His theory does seem to make sense, but may only apply to Hi-Po race motors running very heavy oil and tight, high volume pumps?


The ¼” hexagon aftermarket oil drive shafts are indeed more prone to breakage at the ends but that’s to be expected with the design where it steps down at the ends whereas the stock ¼” shafts are known for their ability to twist like a pretzel before snapping.  But the shafts never break because of a defective or weakened shaft but generally because of the oil pump locking up.  As a rule, the aftermarket shafts are strong enough that snapping the roll pin in the distributor gear can take place before a shaft failure which is a good safety fuse versus a shaft that simply twists until it breaks and the engine keeps running.
The original thought process on the heavier shafts was to reduce the harmonics being transmitted to the distributor thereby reducing spark scatter at the higher rpms.  This was very important with point distributors and although not as big a player with the more modern electronic distributors, is still worth considering in this regard.


I don't positively know if this will solve the problem(s) being experienced with the SBF replacement distributor from CARDONE but there is a longer shaft (OEM - NOS) available as well as performance aftermarket.

IMO, if someone while assembling an engine, can verify correct driveshaft length within correct dimensional specs with an OEM FYB DIST AND the CARDONE SBF (w/ correct driven gear position) replacement and post the findings, it will alleviate doubt.

If the shorter driveshaft either slips out or breaks while running, you know what can happen.





____________________________

57RancheroJim
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 2 Years Ago
Posts: 729, Visits: 112.0K
Thank you, thats good info to know, I had no idea they had a longer shaft after 60-61..
KULTULZ
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)Supercharged (4.4K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 2 days ago
Posts: 1.8K, Visits: 306.3K
oldcarmark (5/22/2018)


You are correct Jim. It is 1/4 Inch shorter as shown in pictures-not 1/2". The Gear is higher on the Shaft than original. Even at 1/4" shorter its still not engaging the Oil Pump Shaft by much. As I mentioned the Ones that were made in USA before they shifted Production to Mexico were correct Length at 6" and the Gears were properly located.

I have not heard of One made in Mexico yet that has correct Dimensions. Cardone just seems to want to ignore the Problem. Buyer beware!


Here is the problem(s) as I see it.

CARDONE is using SBF distributor cores. The actual housing will fit the FYB, the distributor shaft is shorter than the FYB. While the drive gear can be re-positioned (verify this when removed from box) on the SBF shaft, the dist shaft will be too short to engage the driveshaft fully. Also, the end of the shaft is mildly tapered to allow fairly easy dist install, so then there is even more slop.

FORD made a running change in 60/61 regarding oil pumps and the later pump (C1AE 6600-B) requires a longer driveshaft.

Pre 1960/61 used shaft B9A 6A618-A (L= 8 1/16") while 61/ used shaft CIAE 6A618-A (L= 8 1/4"). Both are still available from vendors.

Either maybe go with this or find a good FYB core and have it professionally gone through. While CARDONE was once a quality re-builder, it seems they have no real concern now. They also seem to be doing only cosmetic rebuilds so you will have no idea of what curves you will end up with (or quality of IGN parts).

PREVIOUS THREAD- http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/Topic13087-2.aspx






____________________________

oldcarmark
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Week
Posts: 3.7K, Visits: 32.6K
You are correct Jim. It is 1/4 Inch shorter as shown in pictures-not 1/2". The Gear is higher on the Shaft than original. Even at 1/4" shorter its still not engaging the Oil Pump Shaft by much. As I mentioned the Ones that were made in USA before they shifted Production to Mexico were correct Length at 6" and the Gears were properly located. I have not heard of One made in Mexico yet that has correct Dimensions. Cardone just seems to want to ignore the Problem. Buyer beware!

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/Uploads/Images/a82cee8f-be33-4d66-b65d-fcd8.jpg  http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/339ed844-0bc3-4c73-8368-5dd3.jpg
57RancheroJim
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 2 Years Ago
Posts: 729, Visits: 112.0K
Looking back at your pictures from a few weeks ago the difference looks like a 1/4". I don't have a loose FE oil pump shaft to measure, just a thought.
oldcarmark
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Week
Posts: 3.7K, Visits: 32.6K
I don't know where the difference would be that allows it to still engage the shaft. The difference of 1/2 " shorter is from the Pad that sits on the Block to the end of Shaft. Look at the Pictures I posted a couple of Weeks ago showing the Measurement of the 30-2808 replacement and the Original I have. Doesn't make sense that it still engages Oil Pump Shaft.

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/Uploads/Images/a82cee8f-be33-4d66-b65d-fcd8.jpg  http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/339ed844-0bc3-4c73-8368-5dd3.jpg
charliemccraney
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)

Group: Moderators
Last Active: Last Year
Posts: 6.1K, Visits: 443.0K
If the distributor shafts are 1/2" shorter, then none of the pump shaft can be engaged, everything else equal.  If they work at all, then something else is different and making up the difference in length.


Lawrenceville, GA
oldcarmark
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Week
Posts: 3.7K, Visits: 32.6K
That's interesting because the Distributor Shafts are 1/2 " Shorter than the Original Units. So how much of the Oil Pump Shafts are actually being engaged by the Distributor Shaft? Not much by the sounds of it. I guess if You were to use a longer Oil Pump Shaft You could use these Distributors if You wanted to take a Chance that the Gear on the Distributor will work even though its not positioned correctly either. The Units they are selling do not match the Dimensions that Cardone itself says they should be.Not sure what the Alternative is because I won't be using One of these 30-2808. They seem to be selling a lot of them on Ebay. Cardone don't seem to care that the Units they are producing are not assembled correctly. Buyer  beware as the saying goes!   

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/Uploads/Images/a82cee8f-be33-4d66-b65d-fcd8.jpg  http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/339ed844-0bc3-4c73-8368-5dd3.jpg
charliemccraney
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)Supercharged (9.8K reputation)

Group: Moderators
Last Active: Last Year
Posts: 6.1K, Visits: 443.0K
Better late than never, hopefully.  I have 3 to measure.  All engage the distributor by about 3/8" from the tip but the taper of the tip is about 1/8" so that is 1/4" of effective engagement.


Lawrenceville, GA
oldcarmark
Posted 8 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)Supercharged (6.1K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Week
Posts: 3.7K, Visits: 32.6K
http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/4cd63cf3-844d-4d1f-8e13-e116.jpgThey sent Me a Picture showing the Dimensions that their 30-2808 is supposed to be. Its the same as original with the exception of the 1/4 inch short on the Bottom. Problem is the Dimensions in their Sample Picture do NOT match the Distributor I received and then returned. I would really like to get them to take this seriously and fix the Problem. They are really the only Source for Stock Type replacement Y Block Distributors. If We can't use One of theirs what are We supposed to use unless You want to spend a lot more Money for the new Aftermarket One's? I have requested that they send Me picture with 2 other Dimensions. Pad to bottom of the Gear and Pad to end of Shaft.

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/Uploads/Images/a82cee8f-be33-4d66-b65d-fcd8.jpg  http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/339ed844-0bc3-4c73-8368-5dd3.jpg


Reading This Topic


Site Meter