New Member - First Post

Due to cold starting issues and the relative inaccessibility to the inside of the distributor, I decided to get an electronic ignition kit from Pertronix.

I struggled, but got the thing installed (couldn't get the rubber grommet all the way through the hole in the back of the dist, but whatever...) I even had to curl the wire lead ends to get them through the hole, so it must be smaller than most.

The car is very original 43,000 miles, so I suspect it has the original distributor.

It had been changed to negative ground prior to my purchasing it so I ordered the version for the negative ground 6 volt system.

At first the car wouldn't start. Then I noticed it would cough and gasp at the moment I let off the starter. Well eventually it started but ran rough, especially at low RPM.

I called Pertronix and they suggested it might be low voltage, so I did the test running the extra wire from the Pos side of the Distr to the battery and it seemed to be the answer.

Now, to my actual question (FINALLY!).

Pertronix says to run an additional wire lead to a switched (on only when key is on) power source. I'm wondering what is the EASIEST source for that. I even thought of running it back through the firewall to the ignition in parallel with the existing wire.

Final informational point. I don't understand electricity. It's like some kind of voodoo witchcraft to me. Thus I got my engineering degree in Civil/Dirt engineering to avoid it if at all possible.

To be frank, I'm kind of disappointed the situation exists at all? The kits are sold as drop in (plug and play) so now I've got a piggy-back problem to solve.

TIA for any and all advice!

Meandean

The easiest is usually the original wire that went to the points. However, if that is what you are doing and you're not getting full voltage, you will need to find out why. The problem is most likely not related to the Pertronix, but the 58 year old car, corrosion, a bad wire, a poor connection, a faulty ignition switch, etc. Pertronix cannot account for those kinds of problems.


Lawrenceville, GA

Okay, the tech from Pertronix said the original points are less demanding as far as the required voltage versus their electronic system. I wonder what percent work fine out of the box and what percent have this issue.

Regardless, thanks for the reply.

I have a Pertronix that has worked well for at least 10 years. My impression is that if a car runs poorly or not at all some owners buy a Pertronix and expect it will act like a miracle cure. Sorry, you still need to do the basic type of maintance and upkeep. Old age, wear and tear can and do cause problems and they will have to be addressed if you want a good running car. Pete

Running a parallel back to the ignition switch may help - but be aware the voltage may be low, even to the starter switch. The connection points for the wiring may have corrosion etc. all the way through. A cheapo volt meter is what you need to troubleshoot this stuff - visit Sears or Walmart. Even my dad (a CE for 60+ years) eventually learned to make lights work.

Every connection - back to the battery - is a place to lose voltage and with a six volt system, you don't have to lose much to have a problem. The Pertronix brain is probably happy down to 5 volts - and then its losing interest. The points on the other hand have no brain and will happily cause an inductive spark at a lot lower value.

You can also lose voltage on the ground side of this system - so the base of the Pertronix module must ground back to the engine block (which in turn must have a good ground to your battery). If those grounds have internal resistance - it will also drop the voltage.

Have fun!

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

Thanks Steve. That's what I'm going to try first.

The Pertronix instructions say to run the red wire to another 6 volt switched source, so I'll try that.

I think I may have a voltmeter (free from Harbor Freight) or my youngest brother is an electrician (with a 57 custom, now with a 390, that's been in the family since new) so I can call on him if I end up baffled.

Okay, I ran a parallel wire from the + side of the coil to the ignition. I found where the radio is connected and used that same pole off the ignition since the radio only comes on with the ignition. Went to start it and again, it only wants to kick/start at the instant when I'm disengaging the starter. Obviously the starter is sucking all the oomph while it turns and only when released does the ignition get up to voltage and allow the engine to start.

The first near start was kind of spooky. I have the air cleaner off while working and gasoline sprayed up out of the carburetor. I wiped it down and waited a while and tried it again and it started - initially I thought it was idling smoothly. I turned it off and tried it again and when it started the second time it seemed back to running rough at idle.

I broke out the multimeter and tested the voltage. With the key on and engine off I got reading all over the place, but mostly in the high 5's (5.8 etc), with some down in the 2's. The meter readings changed at least once a second. That was from the hot side of the coil with the red probe and grounding the black probe on the intake manifold. I would think that would be adequate for the Pertronix.

I suppose it would be a good idea to take a similar reading while the starter is cranking. I would need to get my neighbor over to crank the engine while I do that.

Not sure what to try next.

If it started and ran fine when you installed a jumper wire from the battery to the positive side of the distributor, as described in your original post, I don't think the starter is using all of the juice. That points to a wiring problem, corrosion, connections, bad wire, bad switch, bad grounds, etc.

The probes of the multimeter need to touch clean metal/wiring. If they don't then the readings can be erratic.

Have you checked the timing since installing the Pertronix? You can reinstall the jumper wire to do this. I wouldn't expect that swapping the module would cause the timing to be so far off that it is difficult to start, but it should be checked.

Other than the cold starting issue, did it run well before the Pertronix install?


Lawrenceville, GA

Yes, it ran well before I started. Just sometimes it would take 10-15 or even 20 seconds to start from cold. Usually it would pop right off without giving it any gas when warm. So, no, I'm not trying to fix a car with a lot of issues with the Petronix system, just mostly wanted the reliability and not having to get at those points in the GM-ish distributor location. I will admit to sorta HOPING it would help the cold starting performance.

Since the wire to the battery test was successful, wouldn't that eliminate the ground side from the equation?

I'm am also wondering about the timing with the gas popping out of the carb. Does that sound retarded or too advanced? I'm guessing retarded..

I may not be tracking the discussion clearly, but it sounds vaguely familiar to a mystery I once had... not a problem of low voltage, but instead one of No voltage.

I powered the coil from the small "starter" (S) pole of the solenoid, and it fired up as expected. But when I let the key return to the run position, the starter of course stopped (as intended), but so did any ignition voltage to the coil. The coil needed to be powered by the "ignition" (I) pole on the solenoid for the motor to run after the starter feed cycled out.

This was on a 12 volt `62 Bird with a 390 ci and a Pertronix II conversion... it may have nothing to do with your situation, but I thought I share. I just don't think your issue is low voltage, but rather no voltage during run ignition.

Cheers... Brian

Cylinder Index = 84

Current Experiment = `57 Tbird, Grand Rapids, Michigan