Profile Picture

Pertronix Flame Thrower problems (again)

Posted By Nat Santamaria 10 Years Ago
You don't have permission to rate!
Author
Message
57RancheroJim
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Year
Posts: 729, Visits: 112.0K
I have been running the original Ignitor and Flamethrower coil without a resistor for a couple of years now without a problem but I never feel secure with electronic parts. I just ordered a Pertronix II and matching coil and will carry the old one as a back up.
The extra CFM shouldn't effect your running rich condition, is this at idle or at all rpm?
slumlord444
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 3 Months Ago
Posts: 1.2K, Visits: 137.2K
On the carb issue I would try smaller primary jets. Go down in small steps and see if it is any better. You are still under 500 CFM and that should not be too much carb.
Ted
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Co-Administrator

Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)Co-Administrator (13.0K reputation)

Group: Administrators
Last Active: 2 days ago
Posts: 7.4K, Visits: 205.0K
Nat Santamaria (5/18/2015)

....On another note I have the original carb the car came with. It was a Holley 4150 (390 cfm). After having it professionally rebuilt and taking back 3 times, the car ran very rich. The car would continue run even when I turned in the right side mixture screw. I got fed up and put on a new 4160 (465 cfm). Could the additional 75 cfm cause the rich exhaust smell.

I’ve run extremely large carbs on small engines without any pronounced richness at idle.  If the carb is originally designed for a large cubic inch engine, then the idle circuitry may have to be tweaked for the smaller engine but carburetor cfm rating by itself is not a determining factor for if the carb will be rich or not at idle.  Here’s a picture of a 1050 Dominator on a Y which idles just fine.  The carb ultimately may be too big when fully opened but that’s another issue.
http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/e6d6a46a-930d-4e28-90d1-e0bb.jpg 




Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)


Nat Santamaria
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 3 Years Ago
Posts: 165, Visits: 4.8K
I just pulled all the plugs for an inspection. All plugs vary slightly in colour but 4 of 8 are a nice tan colour indicating a clean burn. 2 more are slightly lighter tan. The #5 cylinder is extremely sooty & black and #2 is a darker brown. I took the temperatures at the exhaust manifold and #5 was reading about 392˚ while the other cylinders were in 490 - 510 range. I decided to check the plugs as I had developed a misfire.
The Hotter Pertronix Flamethrower coil masked this problem. Gas mileage is poorer and stronger smell of exhaust after going back to stock coil.

Any ideas on correcting the #5 ? maybe a bad plug or wire?
GREENBIRD56
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Year
Posts: 1.7K, Visits: 102.7K
Nat - Do the "slightly" different plugs match the pattern of "every other one" in the firing order? When using the factory "cross H" intake, it will help indicate which side of the carb is the richer of the two. As built, the split manifold will feed four cylinders from one primary bore - and four from the other. 

On the primary side of the carb - above the throttles,at the airhorn there is an idle bleed orifice on each side. If there is something causing one to flow (air) freely and not the other - the two throttles will not tune the same on the mixture screws. Sometimes you can clear them by blasting carb cleaner down the orifices. I've also found problems with the primary metering block gasket - which is a bit more involved.

Could number 5 have lost its exhaust pushrod? 

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/9ea2bf28-00c4-4772-9ac7-d154.jpg 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona
57RancheroJim
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)Supercharged (1.6K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Year
Posts: 729, Visits: 112.0K
If you have one cylinder that isn't firing/burning like the rest I would start with a compression check first...
Nat Santamaria
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 3 Years Ago
Posts: 165, Visits: 4.8K
Hey Greenbird. The Intake is the stock manifold ECZ-9425-B. The plug reading are as follows

#1 Tan
# 2 Slight darker tan
#3 Tan
#4 Lighter Tan
#5 Very sooty
#6 Tan
#7 Tan
#8 Lighter Tan

GREENBIRD56
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)Supercharged (2.3K reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: Last Year
Posts: 1.7K, Visits: 102.7K
Nat - In the "cross H" design scheme of the intake manifold, cylinders 1,4,6,7 are fed from the same throttle - and 2,3,5,8 from the other. When I first got my car and drove it home - pulled all of the plugs - 1,4,6,7 were nearly fouled (and the others all looked nice). Took a minute or two for it to register that the black plugs shared the same throttle bore. The '56 had the antique teapot carb - and I soon fitted the engine with a later manifold and ignition to escape .......   

Do you have a "spare" plug wire to put on #5 for a trial?  

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/9ea2bf28-00c4-4772-9ac7-d154.jpg 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona
Nat Santamaria
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 3 Years Ago
Posts: 165, Visits: 4.8K
Hey thanks Steve for your response. A mechanic friend of mine are now going through the process of elimination. So far we replaced the distributor cap that was worn and had carbon build-up and replaced the rotor and replaced the #5 plug. With those changes alone when I started it up heavy carbon blew out the back.
Then I temporarily installed brand new stock mustard top coil. Again results are still better. The misfire is still there but significantly less.
The coil I had in there is the original one that came with the car when the car was restored in 1993. I believe that the misfire at #5 cylinder problem was masked a bit by using the flamethrower coil. With the Flamethrower the #5 plug would be more in the normal colour range and all the other plugs would be a bit brighter than tan. The next item we will check is valve lash on that cylinder. He also suggested replacing the ignitor with a new ignitor. If I go back to using flamethrower coil I will hook it up to external resistor despite what Pertronix tech support advises.


Thanks
Nat Santamaria
Posted 10 Years Ago
View Quick Profile
Supercharged

Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)Supercharged (251 reputation)

Group: Forum Members
Last Active: 3 Years Ago
Posts: 165, Visits: 4.8K
We did a compression test on this cylinder and it was 130 lbs. This fouling problem is not new but I have been using a flamethrower coil for several years and probably masked the problem due to the higher voltage and higher burn temperatures. I want to go back to the Flamethrower however the lack of reliability scares me. If I use the Flamethrower 1 with the external resistor does it affect the 40,000 volt output and if so by how much? Until we sort out the problem, could I run a hotter plug in that cylinder? I am running Autolite Copper 46 right now. I am currently using a Stock Ford Mustard top coil. What would the output voltage be on that coil using the external resistor? Is the Ignitor 2 and Flamethrower 2 any more reliable and is there any performance advantage?
Thanks


Reading This Topic


Site Meter