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1957 B manifold modification ?

Posted By RossL Last Week
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RossL
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Reason for this post.............was the manifold opened too much?

My 55 Thunderbird has a stock 292 with a Holley electric fuel pump (measured 5.5 pounds of pressure), manifold vacuum is 20

I took my new to me B manifold to get the inside blasted since it was filled with rust.  I asked the machine shop to open the ports because my Edlebrock carb secondaries could not fully open.  I showed them a picture that Ted posted on a previous post.   They decided to open the the intake (see picture below) and cut the divider (that runs down the center of the manifold).  They probably removed half of the height of the divider because it was "better"
I can't get the car to "move" when I go to WOT from a dead stop.  The car actually stalls out if I don't start pumping the pedal.  It runs pretty good in all other scenarios (around town, highway), it even works fine from a dead stop "if" I slowly apply the throttle.......


Moved the accelerator pump in all positions
Installed a richer Accel pump nozzle
Floats are set to 7/16" with a 15/16" drop
I've tried 3 additional jet and rod combinations per the tuning guide (one lean and two setting on the rich side) 
Tried different Edelbrock step up springs (per Edelbrock and vac readings I am settling on the silver springs
Initial timing is set to 15 degrees (Ive tried 10 to 20)  Distributor is a CRT
Tried adjusting the vacuum advance with the Allen/set screw and I also tried a limited plate for less vacuum advance
Tried ported and manifold vacuum for vac advance
I disconnected the trans kick down rod for a brief test
There is probably a few other things I can't remember at the moment.................so please ask away

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/6cc9795f-697b-4e70-afbb-79b3.jpg

Do you think the manifold "opening" could be causing the problem?   I really do NOT want to do this but today I might put the original manifold back on and use a carb adapter to put the Edelbrock on the 55 intake.... I want to see if the problem is the carb or the manifold
Joe-JDC
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Two things come to mind looking at your intake.  They should have milled the carb pad down to get rid of the open space  around the plenum so that it seals off the underside of the carburetor.  Second they should not have milled the divider down.  Proven to lose torque or have a torque dip at part throttle.  The carb pad can be milled completely flat and a 1/4" or 1/2" four hole spacer used to seal that area.  Eric Weingartner just proved that those slots hurt performance on dyno testing, and Ted and I did dyno testing and came to the conclusion that it almost always is a loss somewhere in the rpm band.  JMO, but I do not slot an intake for anyone unless it is strictly a race engine.  Joe-JDChttp://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/c6cb9519-3922-4365-8776-443b.jpg  
This intake manifold on my 304 cubic inch EMC engine made 438 hp in testing before the Challenge.  We used a Mummert for the actual competition since it made about 14 more horsepower.  This manifold is fully ported and flows ~289cfm average.  The Mummert flow more.  





JDC
55blacktie
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RossL (9/16/2026)
Reason for this post.............was the manifold opened too much?

My 55 Thunderbird has a stock 292 with a Holley electric fuel pump (measured 5.5 pounds of pressure), manifold vacuum is 20

I took my new to me B manifold to get the inside blasted since it was filled with rust.  I asked the machine shop to open the ports because my Edlebrock carb secondaries could not fully open.  I showed them a picture that Ted posted on a previous post.   They decided to open the the intake (see picture below) and cut the divider (that runs down the center of the manifold).  They probably removed half of the height of the divider because it was "better"
I can't get the car to "move" when I go to WOT from a dead stop.  The car actually stalls out if I don't start pumping the pedal.  It runs pretty good in all other scenarios (around town, highway), it even works fine from a dead stop "if" I slowly apply the throttle.......

If you have a stock 292, you should have left the B intake alone, other than possibly blocking off the heat crossover. 

I bought a Mummert aluminum intake. Although I haven't installed it yet, I would have preferred that the plenum divider was not notched; but it's a small notch. 


Moved the accelerator pump in all positions
Installed a richer Accel pump nozzle
Floats are set to 7/16" with a 15/16" drop
I've tried 3 additional jet and rod combinations per the tuning guide (one lean and two setting on the rich side) 
Tried different Edelbrock step up springs (per Edelbrock and vac readings I am settling on the silver springs
Initial timing is set to 15 degrees (Ive tried 10 to 20)  Distributor is a CRT
Tried adjusting the vacuum advance with the Allen/set screw and I also tried a limited plate for less vacuum advance
Tried ported and manifold vacuum for vac advance
I disconnected the trans kick down rod for a brief test
There is probably a few other things I can't remember at the moment.................so please ask away

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/6cc9795f-697b-4e70-afbb-79b3.jpg

Do you think the manifold "opening" could be causing the problem?   I really do NOT want to do this but today I might put the original manifold back on and use a carb adapter to put the Edelbrock on the 55 intake.... I want to see if the problem is the carb or the manifold


55blacktie
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Joe-JDC (9/16/2026)
Two things come to mind looking at your intake.  They should have milled the carb pad down to get rid of the open space  around the plenum so that it seals off the underside of the carburetor.  Second they should not have milled the divider down.  Proven to lose torque or have a torque dip at part throttle.  The carb pad can be milled completely flat and a 1/4" or 1/2" four hole spacer used to seal that area.  Eric Weingartner just proved that those slots hurt performance on dyno testing, and Ted and I did dyno testing and came to the conclusion that it almost always is a loss somewhere in the rpm band.  JMO, but I do not slot an intake for anyone unless it is strictly a race engine.  Joe-JDChttp://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/c6cb9519-3922-4365-8776-443b.jpg  
This intake manifold on my 304 cubic inch EMC engine made 438 hp in testing before the Challenge.  We used a Mummert for the actual competition since it made about 14 more horsepower.  This manifold is fully ported and flows ~289cfm average.  The Mummert flow more.  




If it's "strictly a race engine", Mummert's single-plane manifold might be the way to go. 
55blacktie
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Ross, if you have a stock 292, you should have left the B manifold as is, with the possible exceptions of blocking off the heat crossover. No offense, but compared to the B manifold that Ted Eaton modified for me, yours looks like it's been butchered. 
DANIEL TINDER
Posted 9 days ago
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I’m a bit puzzled why anyone would spend money modifying (especially experimentally) an iron manifold, when better performing/look-alike aluminum models are readily available, and with accurately predictable performance specs (?).

6 VOLTS/POS. GRD. NW INDIANA
RossL
Posted 9 days ago
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Thank you for all the responses.  But I am here asking for help determining if the manifold is causing the problem I am having.  At this point I am very upset with the job done by this local shop and I really don't need people to ask why and why not........................it's done and I am ready to move on if necessary.

And if you really must know, Ted suggested the mod in another post.  I showed the "machinist" the picture Ted provided...............when I went to pick it up I couldn't ask him to undo it

Big Tim
Posted 9 days ago
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"Reason for this post.............was the manifold opened too much?"

I would say it was opened too much. Normally those slots are maybe .25 deep and 1 inch long? People say they help with "tuning" but the tuning they refer to is tuning for max power at high rpm, not off idle performance on a basically stock engine.
You're engine essentially has a single plane on it now.
Having said all that, maybe try adding less pump? Or turning in the idle mix screws? Sounds like its rich and bogging off the line. If it was lean I would think it would back fire out the carb. It's also hard to say if the manifold or the new carb is the issue since they were changed together and not one before the other.
KULTULZ
Posted 9 days ago
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'I’m a bit puzzled why anyone would spend money modifying (especially experimentally) an iron manifold, when better performing/look-alike aluminum models are readily available, and with accurately predictable performance specs (?)."

A person may want improved performance without the added appearance of aftermarket speed parts.

Like a dedicated restoration whereas the outer appearance (CASTING and DATE CODES) has to appear as OEM   

"BEAUTIFUL ENGINE DETAILING! ... why is the curb idle so lumpy?"

"I think I might have a bad plug wire ..."  ... Cool

It has to be run on a dyno or flow bench to determine any damage. 

It might be a good idea to drive it with a manifold vacuum gauge attached to see if there is any vacuum leakage resulting
in LEAN TIP-IN HESITATION. 




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KULTULZ
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"I would say it was opened too much. Normally those slots are maybe .25 deep and 1 inch long? People say they help with "tuning" but the tuning they refer to is tuning for max power at high rpm, not off idle performance on a basically stock engine.

You're engine essentially has a single plane on it now."


WHAT HE SAIDI ...

SINGLE PLANE is a bear on the street for normal driving. Maybe with TBI but not carb, unless a SATURDAY NIGHT SPECIAL (IMO)


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