Moz,

         You're right about the hard water, too much iron in the water acts like a conducter, Sulpher's no help either.  

Frank/Rebop

Bristol, In ( by Elkhart) 

I'm with Gary on this.  Living in the Great White North anti freeze mixtures run 60 to 65 % because throughout the year we can go from -40F to +95.  it not only keeps your car from freezing, it also raises the boiling point a few degrees.  I use it in my daily driver as well.

Using aluminum intakes back in the '70s and working in the aircraft industry taught me a bit about electrolysis, so I started using distilled water in the rad & the battery.  The distillation process takes all of the minerals out of the water, so It extends battery life and cuts corrosion of cooling system parts to nil. 

Larry D

Winnipeg, MB Canada Eh!


'57 Fairlane 500 Club Victoria

'58 Custom 300 Tudor

'56 Crown Victoria

'61 Starliner Z Code

'51 Ford Victoria

What about the theory that pure distilled/de-ionized water, being "mineral hungry", can also be deleterious to the metals in the cooling system?

6 VOLTS/POS. GRD. NW INDIANA

Daniel:

Thanks for bringing that up.  I was going to mention it, but decided to let it rest.  Now it's awake.

Where I worked, we had electronic high frequency induction heaters to heat billets before upsetting or extruding them.  We used deionized (not quite the same as distilled) water to cool them, and was told by the manufacturers of the heaters not to use pure deionized, it was too aggressive and would dissolve copper and aluminum from the cooling systems.  We mixed deionized and tap water, and used an ohm meter with the leads an inch apart in a cup of the water, was looking for between 100,000 and 150,000 ohms.  More than that, too aggressive, less than that, to much conductivity which killed the efficiency of the heater.  Bled too much power to ground through the water, even though we had rubber hose connections between the heart of the heater and the heat exchanger, which was connected to ground.  We couldn't even use black water hoses because the carbon content of the rubber made them conductive.  These units operated at 3,000 or 10,000 cycles per second depending on model, so I didn't know if the aggressive water problem was similar to a car's cooling system or not.

John in Selma, IN

John - "The Hoosier Hurricane"

Chemistry isn't my long suit (if there is one I have) - but aren't we talking about adjusting the "pH" of the coolant soulution? Seems like Ford (or GM) might have a number for this somewhere....

Tap water usually has desolved minerals - therefore is it "acid" or "base"? The mixing instructions John was talking about are a practical way to correct an imbalalnce.

Would the best descrioption be that we want the coolant to be "neutral" when all is mixed together? Could this be checked with something like the pH meter my wife uses for her garden soil? 

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

So I did a Google of the "pH of coolant" and got this for a recommended value from an outfit that sells the coolant testing instruments:

"Extensive testing has shown that a coolant pH below 8.3 is not acceptable for use in engines due to its corrosive nature. The correct pH value should be maintained between 9.5 and 10.0 pH. Below 9.0 pH it is advisable to flush the cooling system and refill with a new coolant solution"

A pH of 7.0 is exactly neutral - this amount described is a "base" solution and the scale goes up to 14.0 max. Fluid pH below 7.0 is considered "acidic" and 1.0 is max.

Guess I ought to find a new "instrument " for my garage - my 312 is full of distilled water (cheap at Walmart) with a bottle of Prestone anti-rust additive package only. I don't have a clue what the pH is .....but it sounds like it might be a good idea to know. Just a guess - I'd say the water is 7.0 and the additive package turns it "base" - but it may need more than one bottle to get up to the range described. the stuff made my radiator water look abit "milky"......

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

Go to any large truck or machinery shop and ask them about this.Cummins and Cat(presumably the others also) sell an inexpensive test kit to check the PH.The kit will tell you if it needs adjusting and the dealer can sell you the additive to correct the level.

 

Paul,

Boonville,MO

I usually use reverse osmosis water from my drinking-supply filter faucet, mixed with just enough alkaline, clean bottled spring water to keep the Ph up and counteract low-ion aggression.



You would think there should be a standardized formula for CORRECT coolant water, but I have never seen one!

6 VOLTS/POS. GRD. NW INDIANA

Still looking around for more info .......found a bit more at www.finalube.com .......this information we are searching for is primarily an item of interest to diesel fleet owners or manufacurers of diesel engines. Fina had this:

"Water Quality is extremely important if make-up water is added, or if coolant is diluted. Major engine makers recommend the following coolant make-up water specifications:

• Hardness (calcium), less than 170 ppm
• Chlorides, less than 40 ppm
• Sulfates, less than 100ppm
• pH neutral

Water exceeding any of the above specifications should not be used. Use distilled water, de-ionized water, or equivalent."

also:

"Glycol: Engine manufacturers recommend coolant composed of 50/50 water/glycol solutions providing enhanced freeze and boil protection. An operating range of 40% to 60% antifreeze (glycol) is acceptable. Use of glycol percentages exceeding 65% may cause SCA dropout, waterpump seal leakage (!) and engine overheating."

and:

"pH:Coolant pH values have a "normal" range of 8.5 -10.5 when precharged with nitrite/nitrate or nitrite-molybdate SCA." ----(SCA is "Supplemental Coolant Additive")

"When pH is (found) less than 8.0, coolant should be drained and flushed."

"Coolant pH exceeding 11.5 will corrode aluminum and promote scaling"

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

The guys at NAPA came up with part number 4106 from the filter line which is a little white bottle with 50 Coolant test strips ($20 - yikes!).

Immersing the strips in the coolant sample (at less than 110°F) causes three bands on the strip to change color. The three stipes are (1)  Nitrite ppm (2) Freeze point °F (3) pH 

It also warns that these strips ar not for use with Texaco Longlife Coolant or Dexcool

I may need to "test" the warehouse forklift........

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona