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EMC Deal

Posted By yehaabill 14 Years Ago
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Ted
Posted 14 Years Ago
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yblockpinto (10/11/2010)
GREAT job Ted, You Have made us all Proud to be part of the Yblock world.
Is this Greg?  The same Greg that spanked the Y-Blockers (myself included) on both Saturday and Sunday at the Y-Block Shootout?  Surely there can’t be two Y-Block powered Pintos.  Glad to see you here and welcome aboard.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)


Ted
Posted 14 Years Ago
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Glen Henderson (10/11/2010)
Ted, you stated earlier that the Y finished 13th in overall H/P, is this factored by cubic inch or was this overall H/P among all the engines?
Glen.  This was based on overall or peak horsepower with no factoring due to cubic inch.  Hearing that I was number thirteen in overall horsepower was a pleasant surprise.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)


Glen Henderson
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To me this is the most amazing fact of the challenge, to windup 13th when you consider that alot of the competion was big inch motors. I don't think it can be said enough, job well done.

Glen Henderson



Freedom is not Free

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charliemccraney
Posted 14 Years Ago
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If I count right, there were 27, maybe 28 motors which were larger. Maybe 28 because one of the contenders that did not finish does not have the displacement listed. It is an early hemi which means it could be a 392. Anyhow, this means that it did better on peak than at least 15 bigger motors! This is very impressive considering that the Y is only in the early stages of development when compared to most of the other engines at the competition.


Lawrenceville, GA
glrbird
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Ted

What are the chances that this combination might make it into a street car to see what real world situation would be like with an engine making that kind to torque and HP.

Gary Ryan San Antonio.TX.

yblockpinto
Posted 14 Years Ago
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Yes, This is Greg. I have raced a couple times since Columbus, the Pinto sure draws the attention. They cant believe a Yblock runs that fast. (went 11.34 @ 117.49) Talked to Walley, he was tickled about the EMC motor. I'm just waiting for next year, to dish it out to the scrubs!Smile

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Greg Dietrich

Mt. Morris IL.
John Mummert
Posted 14 Years Ago
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On the subject of fuel injection I suspect a lot of people will have trouble dealing with FI for the first time. One of the major problems is the crank trigger. I don't know if a CT puts off such a weak signal that it must be set up as a high impedance circuit or all electronic engineers are taught to use high impedance circuits. Whatever the reason these circuits are extremely suseptible to hash from other elctrical devices. The wiring must be kept as far as possible from the injector wiring, alternator ect. Even the throttle position sensor circuit can be a problem. When you are dealing with very high impedances the wiring to the device becomes an antenna, carrys the hash back into the controller where it is amplified and you've got trouble.

What the FI world needs is a low impedance crank trigger and engineers that will forget what they were taught in college about saving money by keeping the current low in the peripheral circuits.

If you've ever had a turntable, record player, that had a hum you coldn't get rid of, you have experience with the problem. That's a 47,000 ohm circuit and I'll bet that crank trigger circuits are much higher than that.

MSD supplies a resistor with some of their ATV ignition boxes. The instructionds don't say what its for and most of the tech guys don't know. Took quite a while to find out it was meant to go from the crank trigger signal wire to ground. Fixed the problem we were having.

http://ford-y-block.com 

20 miles east of San Diego, 20 miles north of Mexico

http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/uploads/images/2c0ef4dd-5dd8-408e-ba0d-74f6.jpg


Ted
Posted 14 Years Ago
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glrbird (10/12/2010)
Ted .... What are the chances that this combination might make it into a street car to see what real world situation would be like with an engine making that kind to torque and HP.

Not talking this particular engine but the combination in general, the chances are actually pretty good but the billet crankshaft does run the cost up in a hurry.  If the pocket book isn’t an issue, then ‘yes’, the same engine could be done for the street and live for awhile.  Getting the cubic inches beyond the ~345 mark in a Y tends to get expensive.  The EMC Y entry was not built on the ragged edge and as a result, there is some durability built into it.  I’ll add that this engine ran well on the same fuel that the other competitors were having difficulty with but there was considerable work up front to insure that the static compression ratio and dynamic compression ratios were happy with each other.

 

The 4” stroke combination is pretty figured out so there’s nothing fancy there other than the Honda rod journals and using an aftermarket rod for the Honda journal.  Very little block work was needed in which to accommodate the longer arm on the crankshaft.  The pistons are obviously custom and I broke away from the ‘D’ shaped inverted dome on this engine and went with a full conical inverted dome so that the combusion pressures would be more centered in the piston rather than on one side.  Not much quench with this design but that doesn’t seem to be a deterrent at this point.  The rings are 1.0mm, 1.2mm, with a 3.0mm 10lb drag oil ring and this ring package is probably marginal for a 100K mile engine but the rings are holding up just fine after 160+ hard dyno pulls.  The rods in the EMC combo are 6.750” long and these are expensive to say the least but obtainable.  Using a 6.300” connecting rod instead lowers the cost significantly with peak horsepower numbers only dropping a small amount.  In fact, low end torque numbers could show an improvement with the shorter rods.

 

The EMC engine in its current format is going back on the dyno to answer some questions that the team came up with at the Challenge.  After this, the engine does get tore down so that a mold of the combustion chamber and part of the cylinder can be made to facilitate making domed pistons specific to the aluminum heads.  When this engine goes back together, it does so with 13-13½:1cr along with a larger camshaft. After testing, the new combination goes into the racecar to see what it can really do.

 

But on a less expensive note, I’m currently working on an aluminum headed 318” Y that gets there with an offset ground 292 crankshaft (3.48” stroke) and is using a 1.5mm, 1.5mm, and 3.0mm ring package.  This engine will have a lower static compression ratio than the EMC engine but simply due to it also having a slightly smaller camshaft to assist in keeping the dynamic compression ratio from being excessive.  It’s hard to guesstimate what the peak horsepower is going to be but all indications point it to being in excess of 450HP in a usable street rpm range.  Both time and testing will tell on this.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)


charliemccraney
Posted 14 Years Ago
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That's impressive. Is that kind of streetable power more available than we think? It seems like the dynos I've seen where the engine is 1.4+ hp/ci, na, the engine is not really streetable, that is unless it's some modern thing with computer controlled timing, injection, etc. With all of the development behind the other engines it just seems like it would be more common. Of course, the others start having trouble staying together around that level. Maybe it's just a Y thingWink



I look forward to the results. It sounds like the bottom end will be about the same as I have. Maybe a kit will be available.BigGrin


Lawrenceville, GA
Park Olson
Posted 14 Years Ago
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Ted, Congrat's again,,,,,and thank you for your informative posts, it's an education in the variables that play into such an endeavor.

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