While Ted is working out the best carb combo/573 Edelbrock manifold setup,I was wondering if Ford was the only one that made a 2x4's manifold or did the after market make any?If so,which one was the best(like the 573 Edelbrock for tri-power)?I know that Ted's hands are full with all the dyno testing the tri-power setups"BUT"----How about a carb/manifold shootout between the best Tri-power vs dual quad vs John Mummert's new alum. 4 barrel manifold/4 barrel carb(Holley-Road Demon-Edelbrock ?) tested on a medium built Y-Block(only thing that changes is manifold /carb combos)!Might save some of us a few $  on the carb/manifold choice for our particlur engine combo(although tri-power sure looks kool).KID

That's more or less what he's doing.


Lawrenceville, GA

Seems to me that Ford never actualy made the manifolds. I think Edlebrock made them. Or am I wrong on this one?

Hi to all, I'm 99% sure that Ford didn't make their dual quad manifolds for the Y-blocks.  There were several aftermarket companies that would have loved to get that contract from Ford.  I think they were probably made by Weiand, I know Weiand made intakes for the Z-28 scrubs so they did manufacturing for the big three.  The edelbrock manifolds are generally heavier, thicker castings which is a good thing.  The Ford dual quad intakes tend to crack on the bottom where the exhaust heat passages go through.  Edelbrock did make at least two dual quad Y-block intakes, a 257 (large port) and a 255 (not sure about that number) which is smaller port of course.  I think there are others, possibly Fenton or Offy or Weiand.  Anyone who has better information, please jump in here.  I'm going from memory from my drag racing days in the 60's.  Have fun, Nick Brann - K.C., MO

By best accounts, Ford made approximately 5500 2X4 equipped cars in 1957.  That explains to some degree why there are always Ford 2X4 intakes for sale at any given time on the Internet.  I suspect Buddy Bar actually did the castings for Ford but it is definitely a Ford design.  The 1957 Ford 2X4 intake requires a valley pan with a recess in which to keep from breaking the ears.  Edelbrock, Offenhauser, Edmunds, Fenton, and Weiand also made 2X4 intakes for the Y with quite a few variations in the design but these were sold to the hotrodders directly and not sponsored by Ford.  Although the factory intakes are plentiful, the recessed valley pans, factory carbs, and air cleaners seem to be in short supply.  I have lucked out at swap meets though and found the factory dual quad teapots individually in piles with other carbs and priced right simply because the people selling them did not realize exactly which teapot carb they were.  I’ve found the factory recessed valley pans under two barrel intakes which tells me the parts simply got moved around or the 2X4 intakes were changed out without removing the valley pans.

 

I’m not planning on a 2X4 comparision anytime in the future but will eventually run my own factory Ford 2X4 setup with original teapots on the dyno mule just to validate the 260-285HP factory claim.  Based on the results I’ve already achieved with the Edelbrock 573 3X2 setup and with the Mummert single 4V intake, the factory 2X4 intake is going to make at least the factory rated numbers on the stock headed engine.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)

Ted,

        I'm curious, why do you guys think Buddy Barr made the dual quad intakes. Ford had aluminum facilities in house, and there were a number of closer sources to Dearborn. I know Winters didn't make them, because of the GM connections, but I'd suspect ECK foundries or Wisconsin Aluminum might have.

Frank/Rebop

Bristol, In ( by Elkhart) 

I’m thinking Buddy Bar only because my factory MEL 3X2 intake has Buddy Bar cast on the bottom of it as well as a good number of my factory FE aluminum intakes.  I’ll not rule out Ford actually doing their own casting of these but Buddy Bar was a Ford affiliate early on so it's just a good guess on my part.  Winters did much of GM’s aluminum intake manifold casting much the same way Buddy Bar did it for Ford.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)

5500 sounds like a lot of manifolds, but in Ford's scheme of things that was a small number.  I wouldn't be surprised if the manifolds would have been outsourced.  I have heard that Buddy Bar did them, but have not seen their logo on any 2-4 manifolds.  Seems like there was a diamond with an S in it on at least some of them.  Familiar logo to you, Frank?

The '56 manifolds had square pads with 4 holes bored in them to intersect the passages below, where the '57s had two of the holes in each pad cast together with a dogbone pattern.  I suspect the '56s were cast with the carb risers as two solid lumps of aluminum, where the '57s used some type of core to reduce machining and wasted material.  The '56 setups used a tappet cover made of flat plate with the oil fill and draft tube setup welded on.  They probably found out late that the regular cover wouldn't work, and needed a quick fix, didn't have time to make dies and stamp a run of covers.  Old Mics, this is your area of expertise.  Can you share anything with us?

John - "The Hoosier Hurricane"

The 5500 quantity produced for the 1957 model year are the numbers that I have from a Ford source.

 Remember that count would also include over the counter sales,warranty replacements and a 3-5% casting imperfection.

That would also take into account all of Fords installations of "E" code engines-T Birds,Rancheros,passenger cars,etc.So about 5000 "E" installed setups from Ford.

The only hard evidence of Buddy Barr being involved is from a paragraph in the 56 Hot Rod (I"ll have to see what month)magazine tieing Buddy Barr to the Mercury M 260 intake manifold design and casting.

Ford racing had a racing relationship with Buddy Barr,Ralph Moody and a few more folks,all of whom were in California at that 1956 era of time.

The "lore" is that Ford farmed out the race only design in late 1955 to both Edlebrock and Buddy Barr with a promise that they would produce all of these style of manifolds for Ford.

Buddy produces the 1956/ M 260 setup which looks suspiously like Edlebrocks FM 255 intake.Thats the manifold with the overhang on the rear carb.The 56 Merc setup used a pair of bakolite spacers under the carb just as the "E" code passenger car did.

Its not very good for driveability (remember this was race only stuff) and Dearborn Steel Tubing gets involved for the 57 model year,driver quality stuff.

The diamond with the "S" in the center is Dearborn Steel Tubing"s casting identification. 

I"m under the impression that Buddy Barr did the Ford 56 manifolds and know for sure that Dearborn Steel Tubing did all of the 57 "E" stuff.

Theres at least two different castings of the Ford 56 manifold (I have both).There is NO evidence of a Dearborn Steel Tubing I.D. on either of those manifolds.

I dont know if all of the facts will ever come to light.There were at that time many aftermarket companys producing a version of the dual quad manifold.Just not with the blessing of Ford.

I contacted Buddy Barr castings years ago with no luck and I am planning an invited trip to Hollman and Moody for a look see in there library.

Oldmics - the truth is out there

       That trip would be neat! I sold the grandson some parts a year or so ago, but he didn't mention the library, I wasn't aware it existed, although the Grandson knew a lot about the history of the place. Sounded like a nice guy. I think you're right about casting I.D. but I doubt they actually cast it. Might have been Barr.   

Frank/Rebop

Bristol, In ( by Elkhart)