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bad coil?

Posted By Lanny White 4 Years Ago
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KULTULZ
Posted 4 Years Ago
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... but I think the '54 Ford manual (addendum) suggests that technicians remove the entire distributor to replace standard tune up parts - points, rotor, condenser. Crazy  I haven't taken that approach yet, but as I get older, I could see how it might be easier than with the distr. on the car....unless it's frozen in place like mine currently is.


The main reason for that is that the LOAD-O-MATIC had to have it's advance springs tension and vacuum advance signal verified (manometer). That was more easily done on a DIST MACHINE.

This was FORD's desire to have the DIST set-up properly. Now in the world of flat-rate, I doubt this happened much. Set points with a matchbook cover and check the timing with a light and slam the hood.



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312YBlock
Posted 4 Years Ago
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I agree with Ted regarding the old condenser. I installed an new “Mallory” condenser and drove to Memphis for a CTCI international. On the way down the engine started to miss then backfire. Rich Martin found someone with a back in the day condenser and it got me home to NY. I had an MSD 6A installed and said good riddance to the resistor and condenser, next step an electronic conversion kit to replace the points. 🚗

1955 312 T-Bird Warwick, NY
DryLakesRacer
Posted 4 Years Ago
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Lanny never responded to Ted’s question on 6 or 12 volts. Burned points in 100 miles sound like 12 with no resister. In my experience the last 1/2” of the point movable arm are would be blue. If 12 volt there are many other items that require changes from the positive ground system. 

56 Vic, B'Ville 200 MPH Club Member, So Cal.
ian57tbird
Posted 4 Years Ago
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I've been happy with NAPA condenser, so far no problems.
Lanny White
Posted 4 Years Ago
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Dry Lakes Racer, my initial post referenced a "stock" '54 Mercury which would be 6 volt positive ground.  No 12 volt issues present!
Lanny White
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Seems like I am chasing my tail.  It starts but barely runs, engines shakes and exhaust periodically pops on driver side.  Can't get it over a very ragged idle at about 800 - 1000 rpm.  Obviously ignition?

New points properly gapped, new condenser, new rotor, new distributor cap, all of which went into a newly rebuilt distributor with about 300 miles on it.  When changing the cap, I switched one plug wire at a time and I don't think I crossed any.  However, if I did, is there a way to test each indidual plug wire following the firing order from the cap to the respective spark plug?

I have the original wire loom seperators attached to the back of the block (2 on each side) and it is very difficult to follow each wire between the firewall and the block to the open space underneath where they turn forward to the plugs.  Can't shake the wires from the top, can't see the wires between the seperators, can't get my hands back there to feel and follow each wire.  I tried a common circuit tester attempting to get 6 volt power to flow from one end of a wire to the other to no avail.

I don't understand the function of the spark control valve in the carb and maybe it is the culprit (carb is a newly rebuilt 1955 model 4v teapot.  I also wonder if there is a possibility that the timing chain may have jumped.

Just to reiterate, the car was running well, I had just returned home from a 50 mile round trip, climbed a mild grade from the highway to the house in 2nd gear and lugged it out as I pulled ito the driveway.  It bucked and snorted and quit.  Acted like it ran out of fuel (which it hadn't).

Any other suggestions?


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Posted 4 Years Ago
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Start from scratch, pull the coil wire from the dist, cap and check the quality of the spark to ground. Never saw a spark control valve kill the ignition. Basically it retards the timing when the engine is put under a load.

Tedster
Posted 4 Years Ago
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I'd agree with that, first pull the coil wire at the distributor cap and then check for quality of spark from coil wire terminal to ground while cranking engine over.

It should be able to jump 1/2" easily, with a fat spark. Only do this test long enough to verify. If this checks out OK, check spark through to each individual plug wire boot & terminal with a spare plug grounded to manifold. Inspect inside of distributor closely with a strong light for evidence of arcing or "carbon tracking", once it starts it is just about impossible to remedy.

Some of that "fancy" test gear mentioned isn't at all expensive these days especially when compared against the value of your time. I bought an ignition oscilloscope complete w/ all the gee-gaws and cables + manuals, for $40, I consider that a steal, it makes short work of troubleshooting and pinpointing any possible ignition problems and it's a whole lot better than guessing, or wonderin', or throwing parts at it!
KULTULZ
Posted 4 Years Ago
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I also wonder if there is a possibility that the timing chain may have jumped.

Just to reiterate, the car was running well, I had just returned home from a 50 mile round trip, climbed a mild grade from the highway to the house in 2nd gear and

lugged it out as I pulled ito the driveway.  It bucked and snorted and quit

Acted like it ran out of fuel (which it hadn't).

I would verify timing. A piston-stop tool is like ten bucks.



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Lanny White
Posted 4 Years Ago
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More diagnosis yesterday.  I had put in new H 10 plugs about 1000 miles ago and checked #1 when setting up for re-installing the dizzy.  It was very badly blackened with carbon (?) buildup (baked on, beyond cleaning).  I pulled the rest and replaced all with new H10s, properly gapped.  I also found that the coil ignition wire terminal connection had nearly seperated from the wire and it actually broke in my hand as I was inspecting it.  Cleaned it up, installed a new terminal, and reattached it.  I traced out all of the plug wires to verify correct placement to their respective plugs and found #8 to be loose.

Eureka!  said I...  Now it will start and run.  Hit the key, a few pumps of fuel, and it started.  Fiddled with the auto choke linkage a little to set the fast idle and reached up to the turn the dizzy to smooth it out.  In doing so, my left arm brushed against the coil which was quite hot after running only 1 1/2 to 2 minutes.  I have never noticed the temperature of a running coil before and expect that it may get hotter the longer it ran, making it too hot to touch in just a few minutes.  I shut the engine off and then I noticed that the exhaust manifolds were extremely hot, burning to the touch, which seemed excessive for such a short run time.

Tedster, I have already re-inspected the new dizzy cap and have verified spark at each plug.  I had also previously checked spark at the coil as you suggest but following yesterday's discovery of the high temperature, I will hold off on further work until I get more feedback.  Regarding diagnostic equipment, all I can remember from "back in the day" was the large Sun machines.  I have no idea what might be available in today's world for a 6 volt, possitive ground, old Mercury.  Any help there will be greatly appreciated.  I do have a timing light, tach/dwell meter, and a vacuum gauge.


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