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By Bill Pabon - 7 Years Ago
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New to the forum and I have no experience at all with the "Y" block. My daughter 23 fell in love with a 55 4 door custom line and the father/daughter project commenced. The car appears to have been a "work in progress" when we bought it from an older gentleman who was no longer able to work on it because of health issues. Before we could get any details about what had been done to the car he had suffered a stroke and could not recall what had been done. So we took a chance on it resolving that the engine appeared to have fresh paint and fresh oil and the coolant was nice and clean in the radiator. Original "oil bath" breather was still in place etc...
After some research and trial and error we managed to get it to start and run after chasing down a 6 volt generator that was missing and new wires etc.. With new points, plugs installed and rebuilding the carb. New gas tank and fuel pump - it starts and runs just fine until the engine gets good and warm and we start to get bluish smoke after 5 to 6 minutes of running.
We did not check the actual engine compression for each cylinder because it did start up after we sprayed engine oil into each cylinder bore to lube everything in case it was dry and after the initial start up smoking it quit smoking. The oil pump is pumping oil into the valve galley and valve springs. Could it be that the valve guide seals are failing?( umbrella seals on valve stems - really can't see into the spring area)
We also did not change or fool with the thermostat for fear of a bolt breaking off etc.. We also did not change any other filters - did noticed it has a down draft tube of some sort with a "can" on the tube? PVC? Help! We were trying to avoid pulling the engine for a full rebuild. If we have to we will. We are going to buy a good compression gauge and start all over and try to find a manual to determine what is acceptable compression readings per each cylinder. Any suggestions will be much appreciated!
Thanks,
Bill in Georgia
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By slumlord444 - 7 Years Ago
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A compression check is a good place to start. Is tempreature gauge working? You need to be sure it is not overheating.
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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The Tube-Can on the side is the Road Draft Tube for Crankcase Ventilation. Air go us in the Oil Fill Cap and exhaust Fumes out the Drft Tube. There is a Filter in there which is accessible by taking the Can off.
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By 2721955meteor - 7 Years Ago
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i would drain the eng oil,look for valve seal bits,also chang the filter. cut the old filter apart. use a wood chisel so no cuttings create fals alarm. at idel the vacume will be high and if valve seals broken this could be the issue . plus it is a cheap first look at what you have. ys are famous for vale seal disintegration. easy to fix with right tools. good luck
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By Ted - 7 Years Ago
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As already mentioned, run a compression test to validate the condition of piston ring and valve seal. Running a vacuum gauge on the engine may also give an indication of engine condition. If the engine is a fresh rebuild, it may simply need to be broken in. There’s a chance the exhaust system is full of oily residue from a previous engine and that will need to be simply burnt out by running the car for awhile. I'll also add that the current engine may have sit long enough for the rings to stick in the piston grooves. In this case, those rings may be loosened by simply heat cycling the engine a few times. In a more worse case scenario, putting oil in the cylinders and then pressurizing each cylinder with air can help to free up the rings.
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By Bill Pabon - 7 Years Ago
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Ok so thanks for your input - going to do the compression test this Saturday. With my best research to date it looks like 130 psi is the number for a perfect scenario regarding each piston bore. What should be the minimum where I determine that the is the issue? Can I vary 30 psi per cylinder bore?
Again thanks for your input - much appreciated!
Respectfully,
Bill in Georgia
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By Bill Pabon - 7 Years Ago
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Hey meteor thanks for that tip - we will also look into that possibility as well! Will advise what we find along with the compression check.
Respectfully,
Bill in Georgia
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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el2721955meteor (7/13/2017)
i would drain the eng oil,look for valve seal bits,also chang the filter. cut the old filter apart. use a wood chisel so no cuttings create fals alarm. at idel the vacume will be high and if valve seals broken this could be the issue . plus it is a cheap first look at what you have. ys are famous for vale seal disintegration. easy to fix with right tools. good luck
I use a Dremel Tool with cutting Wheel. Cut the filter all the way around above the Base. Nice and neat.
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By Ted - 7 Years Ago
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Bill Pabon (7/14/2017)
Ok. So thanks for your input - going to do the compression test this Saturday. With my best research to date it looks like 130 psi is the number for a perfect scenario regarding each piston bore. What should be the minimum where I determine that the is the issue? Can I vary 30 psi per cylinder bore?
It’s desirable for the cranking compression readings between all the cylinders to not vary any more than 10% between the highest and lowest. My 272 runs in the 155-160 psi range on a cranking compression test. That would mean no more than a 16 lb. variance between the lowest and highest readings. Be sure to run the cranking compression test with the throttle blocked wide open.
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By Bill Pabon - 7 Years Ago
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Hey thanks Ted! For your input - should we expect higher compression on our 272 or is your engine been souped up with high performance components? Is my figure of 130 psi cranking pressure for a stock engine incorrect. Please advise!
Respectfully,
Bill in Georgia
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By 55 GLASS TOP - 7 Years Ago
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Just a quick thought, First let me say BRAVO to your young daughter seeing the beauty in an old classic. Regarding your smoke I was wondering if you could be seeing water vapor and not oil could there be a leaking head gasket or a crack in the block when the engine comes up to temp . Just a though
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By Ted - 7 Years Ago
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Bill Pabon (7/14/2017)
Hey thanks Ted! For your input - should we expect higher compression on our 272 or is your engine been souped up with high performance components? Is my figure of 130 psi cranking pressure for a stock engine incorrect. Please advise! Respectfully, Bill in Georgia
In answer to your question, the 1957 Ford Service Manual lists the cranking compression at sea level being 160 lbs. for the eight cylinder engines.
My 272 has been upgraded with an Isky E4 camshaft but is otherwise a stock rebuild at 0.020” over and the original heads. With any increase in camshaft duration, the intake valve does close later which in turn will drop the cranking compression numbers to a lower value. Besides the starter condition also affecting the cranking compression numbers, compression testing gauges can also vary in their readings. As long as the readings are all consistent, I’d not be overly concerned with the actual number based on some of the gauges I’ve used over the years. A gauge that has been used on a ‘hot’ engine will many times give lower than expected readings.
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By Bill Pabon - 7 Years Ago
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Update - after running compression check -had some cylinders at 60 psi - some at 100 psi - so much variance - I'm assuming rings are stuck or maybe cracked? Car had been sitting for a while. Also found one pushrod not there! Discovered this after learning with some more research that "valve lash" settings were important so as I proceeded we discovered that number one is gone- must be in the oil galley broken. So we are going to go through a complete fresh rebuild professionally - we do have a renowned ford guy locally that has the full gamete machine shop and reputation for building reliable engines. Thanks again for everyone's input. We now have a manual for the car which is very informative so we are proceeding! I'm sure when we get the engine and trans and clutch addressed the very next thing we will do is go the 12 volt conversion route and also the electronic ignition conversion so the car can be more reliable.
Thanks everyone for your suggestions and input and look forward to being part of the forums !
Respectfully,
Bill in Georgia
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By PF Arcand - 7 Years Ago
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Bill: I don't have any personal experience with an electronic conversion failure, but according to some on this site & in Y-Block magazine it has occurred. The main reason to do it is convenience, but you might want to carry a points/condensor in your Glove Box..
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By BigAlMD - 7 Years Ago
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Bill,
Just joined this forum, just want to point out that there is a second option for electricity. That is to put in an 8 volt battery, which supplies more amps for cranking and lights. 12V conversion is okay but biggest worry is moving from Positive Ground to Negative Ground. A lot of the light bulbs will probably be needing replacement. As has been stated keep old points, condenser & pigtail wire in car. I've run Pertronics in my '56 Bird and also installed in my son's 65 Mustang 289. Mustang is on its 17th year of use and Bird is on its eleventh. As is typical with any electronic equipment, if it is going to fail, 90+% of these fail in the first 24 hours of usage time.
If you stay with 12V conversion, radio and any other accessories will not need special consideration for negative ground. As for charging, consider putting in a single wire GM style alternator. Voltage regulator is built in and 100 amp unit can be had for not much more than 40 to 60 amp (just my 2 cents worth as I am quite happy having done this.
Sounds like a great Father-Daughter project.
Good Luck,
Al
Columbia MD
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By martyk98 - 7 Years Ago
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sometimes a compression check can be misleading. If the engine is cold it might show good numbers but when it gets hot and things expand, the numbers may change. If so I think your problem might be a head gasket. Just had the same thing happen to me earlier this year with a 67 GTX 440. Ran beautiful cold but stumbled hot.
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