|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
Does anyone have a pic or diagram of the pipe layout for power brakes?Converting mine with a VH40 booster (PBR).Brake bloke said to only plumb the front brakes to booster - any thoughts?
|
|
By snowcone - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Hi Al
I might be wrong but if you still only have the single circuit mastercylinder then you will need to have the booster on all the brakes.I don't see this as an issue as the different size wheel cylinders will still provide proportional braking as it was designed, just now there will be a bit more pressure all round. I have the boosted dual line mastercylinder from Old Irish Dave on 4 wheel drums and I have to say the brakes are fantastic and far better than I anticipated
|
|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
|
I plumbed to the front brakes only today, on two different 'experts' advice.
I figured that if no good I can always re-do them.
Being on Historic Registration, everything is supposed to at least "look" original, therefore no dual circuit system. I hope they don't notice the alternator if i get checked... so fluid goes everywhere, is that standard or do i have dodgy slave cylinders? |
|
By Ted - 10 Years Ago
|
Here’s the link to a previously posted picture of the factory installed brake booster on a ’55 Ford station wagon. All four wheels were power brake boosted.
http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/FindPost23011.aspx
|
|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Thanks Ted.
How DO you keep track of every post ever made, You must have a great filing system ?? |
|
By oldcarmark - 10 Years Ago
|
snowcone (5/10/2014)
Hi Al
I might be wrong but if you still only have the single circuit mastercylinder then you will need to have the booster on all the brakes. I don't see this as an issue as the different size wheel cylinders will still provide proportional braking as it was designed, just now there will be a bit more pressure all round. I have the boosted dual line mastercylinder from Old Irish Dave on 4 wheel drums and I have to say the brakes are fantastic and far better than I anticipated
I was trying to "quote" slick56's" statement about only plumbing the front Brakes to the Booster.
If you only have the front brakes plumbed into the booster what is operating the rear brakes?I did my 56 and my buddies 55 with Drums all around and as mentioned it makes a BIG difference in the way the Brakes work.I have front Discs on my 56 and I redid the plumbing when the Engine was out.It wasn't a great deal of work to make the Drum setup on the 55 into a Dual System using Irish Daves Master/Booster combo.
|
|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
oldcarmark (5/10/2014)
snowcone (5/10/2014)
Hi Al
I might be wrong but if you still only have the single circuit mastercylinder then you will need to have the booster on all the brakes.I don't see this as an issue as the different size wheel cylinders will still provide proportional braking as it was designed, just now there will be a bit more pressure all round. I have the boosted dual line mastercylinder from Old Irish Dave on 4 wheel drums and I have to say the brakes are fantastic and far better than I anticipated
I was trying to "quote" slick56's" statement about only plumbing the front Brakes to the Booster. If you only have the front brakes plumbed into the booster what is operating the rear brakes?I did my 56 and my buddies 55 with Drums all around and as mentioned it makes a BIG difference in the way the Brakes work.I have front Discs on my 56 and I redid the plumbing when the Engine was out.It wasn't a great deal of work to make the Drum setup on the 55 into a Dual System using Irish Daves Master/Booster combo.
The Master goes to a T, one line going to the rear brakes, the other to another T which does both front brakes.I have taken a pipe from the first T (which went to the front brakes) to the booster, then from the booster to the second T which splits to do both front brakes.The rear brakes get pressure direct from the Master.
If i don't like the feel of it, I will plumb from the Master to the booster, then to the first T, and put back the original line from the first T to the front brake T. 
Both 'experts' (from the same brake shop, but on different occasions) were definite about only plumbing the front.
Due to Historic Registration here in South Australia, the car must appear as it came from the factory,but period options are allowed (my painted cragars were available in '56... ) 
I get to use the car 90 days per year, but registration fees are also 1/4th the annual fee, and i can register up to 3 years in advance. A log book has to be filled in every time i drive it though.
|
|
By rick55 - 10 Years Ago
|
In the days of the early GT Falcons only the front brakes were boosted as they had disc brake front and drum rear with a dual circuit master cylinder. The Aus Customlines boosted both front and rear. As stated the wheel cylinders do the brake pro portioning. On a single circuit system with the front boosted and the rear non boosted, I cannot see how the system can work safely. The remote booster acts as a vacuum assisted master cylinder.
I am on historic registration here in West Australia and run a pedal vac system. If I had been confronted about using the booster I would have simply just used the dual master cylinder. In my opinion single master cylinder systems are dangerous. I have had a brake line burst and thankfully had a good working handbrake and manual transmission. With an automatic at highway speed I doubt a handbrake would stop you safely.
I think you received information that "may?" function if you used a dual circuit master cylinder with different hydraulic requirements but certainly not for a single system with drum brakes. What they have done is completely muck up the brake balance.
You will undoubtedly run into the main detractor of drum brakes in an emergency braking situation. Brake fade - as the rears will not be working.
|
|
By miker - 10 Years Ago
|
|
In the late 90's I put disk brakes on the front of my 55 bird, using a common kit. The kit came with an OEM style booster, which boosted the front disk. There were replacement wheel cylinders for the rear drums. Supposedly, the "self energizing" drums, with the proper size cylinders, a dual master, and the boost to the discs in front, would balance. They worked for many years, although the rears did lock early for my taste. I suspect you'll find the rears don't see enough pressure to work properly, and in the event of a failure, nothing works. I had a brake failure, single system, when the line on the rear axle fractured. I never forgot that. I also had a straight road, no cross traffic a manual, and a good handbrake.
|
|
By 56_Fairlane - 10 Years Ago
|
Not a very good picture. I'd like to see a better one if possible. I have a Midland booster I'm planning to install.
|
|
By Talkwrench - 10 Years Ago
|
Guess you would be aware now the VH40 is for disc / drum application. You would have been better with a VH44 you could have plumbed it straight up. ..Bugger.
I just added a VH44 to the front [discs] on my little Triumph.
Im about to add a VH44 to my 35 pickup, drums all round.
My 56 Fairlane on concessional has the old Irish Dave power dual circuit setup. [see as Rick said]
|
|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Talkwrench (5/12/2014)
Guess you would be aware now the VH40 is for disc / drum application. You would have been better with a VH44 you could have plumbed it straight up. ..Bugger.
I just added a VH44 to the front [discs] on my little Triumph.
Im about to add a VH44 to my 35 pickup, drums all round.
My 56 Fairlane on concessional has the old Irish Dave power dual circuit setup. [see as Rick said]
I bought the booster about a year ago, can't remember if 40 or 44, but is the small one, and was recommended for drum/drum.
Would post pics, but that doesn't work anymore...
Do you have a link for the Irish Dave unit?
|
|
By Ted - 10 Years Ago
|
56_Fairlane (5/12/2014)
Not a very good picture. I'd like to see a better one if possible. I have a Midland booster I'm planning to install. I’ve found some better pictures of the factory brake booster line routing but picture posting on my end has been down since the last software upgrade. For now I’m stuck with simply putting up links of pictures that are already on the site.
|
|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Here are a couple of pics of how i fitted my booster.
Have added as attachment as i still can't upload pics...hope that works. |
|
By Talkwrench - 10 Years Ago
|
I think Old Irish Dave has long gone. There is a guy in QLD that sells the stuff that would normally make up that "kit" Its where I got my VH44 boosters from. Ill see if I can find the link http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BRAKE-BOOSTER-CHROME-8-INCH-DUAL-DIAPHRAM-MASTER-CYLINDER-BALL-MILLED-CHROME-/160957132529?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2579caeef1 This should get you started to see what he has Im sure he has the brackets too ..$25 ? Maybe check with us before you leap in IF you decide.
I cant see real well how you have plumbed up the booster as I can see two lines disappearing. Should just be line from M/C to back of booster then the line out of the "nose" of the booster down to your junction [for all brakes]
Now I want to know where did you get your valve covers!!
|
|
By slick56 - 10 Years Ago
|
|
Talkwrench (5/13/2014)
I cant see real well how you have plumbed up the booster as I can see two lines disappearing. Should just be line from M/C to back of booster then the line out of the "nose" of the booster down to your junction [for all brakes]
Now I want to know where did you get your valve covers!!
The Master goes to a T, one line going to the rear brakes, the other to another T which does both front brakes. I have taken a pipe from the first T (which went to the front brakes) to the booster, then from the booster to the second T which splits to do both front brakes. The rear brakes get pressure direct from the Master. This is what the blokes at Power Brakes (PBR) recommended, but i am going to re-do it to all four wheels. I have a lot of play in the brake pedal (always have had), about 1-1/2" before they start to work,
even with the eccentric turned. A bit of dodgy stuff on this car... maybe too short a pushrod?
The valve covers are made by Lindsay Shoemark (the YBloke) I think he is in Dubbo
ybloke56@hotmail.com
|
|
By Talkwrench - 10 Years Ago
|
Mmm 1 - 1 1/2" with that power booster might be about right, I have found they tend to drop a little.. If its a VH44 try plumbing to all brakes. I take it you have adjusted your brakes up?
Dodgy stuff on the car hey.. Mate they ALL seem to have dodgy stuff.. Pfft! Yet to come across a "perfect" one..
I'll chase that guy up about the valve covers..
cheers,..
|