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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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hello, just joined here. bought a 1964 f100 a month or so ago with (what else) a 292 and a 3 speed. it was running (poorly) so i've been doing all the tune up stuff and it got it running...then my starter ceased to crank the engine. took it out and the bendix/ starter drive had exploded. got a new drive an starter from napa (they look identical to what was removed.) now i need to install the drive on the starter and the starter in the truck.
here are my questions:
1. can you install the starter with the drive in the extended or 'start' position or must it be retracted? reason being the two i've gotten from napa were both extended and i cannot get them to retract by hand, with a c clamp, or vise.
2. how the heck do i get this drift pin in? the hole is partially covered and it apears you need to cmpress the drive to get it in but i haven't had any luck with that. i've been searching all over the net and haven't found the answer. i can provide pictures if anyone needs to see exactly what i mean
thanks!
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By lyonroad - 10 Years Ago
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Mac,welcome. I have a 292 and two starters. One is in the extended position and the other not. My motor is out of the car and I managed to install either one without problem (other than aligning the mounting bolts - I temporarily installed a stud in the upper bolt hole to help align the starter ). When I installed the extended one I had the grease cap on the bell housing off so I could see. My understanding is that installation with the motor in the vehicle can be a pain a times. Regarding the drift pin I suspect that you must compress the spring to install. How you accomplish that? Hopefully someone who has the knowledge will reply as I have never done that.
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 10 Years Ago
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Mac:
Push against the spring with the drive butted against something. When the spring is compressed far enough to insert the pin, install it just far enough to hold the spring back but not so far that you can't slide the drive over the shaft. Slide the drive onto the shaft and align the pin with the hole in the shaft and tap the pin into the hole with a small hammer until the spring snaps back over the end of the pin. I have bought drives with the pin already started, and since the NAPA drives were already extended, someone has fooled with them, maybe they also pulled the pin out.
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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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thanks guys. i will try to puh it against my workbench and report back. what i don't understand is if that works how putting the drive in a vise didn't excert enough force to get the pin started.
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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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i mean, i don't think i'm particularly wimpy, this thing just doesn't move. my dad and i were thinking about grinding a flat in the pin but i'm skeptical that would work/is the way to do it. also thought about using a roll pin, but if i have to hammer one in, who is to say the shaft of the starter doesn't bend before the pin goes in? getting near a month since the truck ran; getting impatient with this thing.
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 10 Years Ago
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Mac:
The drive won't retract because of an internal pawl that locks it into the extended position to drive the flywheel. When the engine starts it spins the starter drive fast enough that centrifugal force retracts the pawl and the drive retracts.
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By The Horvaths - 10 Years Ago
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I have found that there are essentially two set of tracks within the heart of the Bendix. If it is assembled with the pawl in one orientation, the Bendix will latch into the extended position. By fully disassembling it and re-orienting the sliding part on the helically-grooved shaft, the Bendix can be rendered non-latching. Which orientation is correct, I do not know. Perhaps both, dependent upon application. The starter that was working on my 239 was free. So, when I rebuilt a spare for the 292, I disassembled it and rotated the sleeve one set of grooves to free it up too.
It is definitely a trick to get that bugger back together. I seem to remember a snap ring giving me nine kinds of grief.
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By awhtx - 10 Years Ago
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Ford tractors from the 50's and early 60's use the same style starter as the Y-block. I know for a fact that if the bendix becomes extended I can hold it up against a spinning wire wheel on a bench grinder and when the bendix reaches the appropriate speed it will jump back to the retracted position.
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 10 Years Ago
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I believe that on a truck the starter can easily be installed even if the drive is extended. The exception may be if the truck has rams horn manifolds.
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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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i have read elsewhere that it can be installed extended, and i don't have ram's horn manifolds. don't know if i want to try taking that thing apart!
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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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got the pin in! put it in my big vice and cranked down on it harder than in previous trys and exposed the hole completley. i though for sure i would break the thing before i'd get the pin in.
stay tuned for starter installation.
thanks for the input, Dan
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By zoegrant - 10 Years Ago
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"if the bendix becomes extended I can hold it up against a spinning wire wheel on a bench grinder and when the bendix reaches the appropriate speed it will jump back to the retracted position" previous quote.ABSOLUTELY..then it is a lot easier to install....John in CT
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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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at least on my f100, it was no problem installing the starter with the drive extended. the only issue was getting that top bolt started.
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By vntgtrk - 10 Years Ago
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mac (2/15/2014)
at least on my f100, it was no problem installing the starter with the drive extended. the only issue was getting that top bolt started.
I have ram horns and don't see any added difficulty. But the exhaust isn't installed yet; just the manifolds. What about the idea of just leaving a stud in the top hole and putting a locking (kep) nut on with a wobbly extension?
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By aussiebill - 10 Years Ago
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vntgtrk (2/15/2014)
mac (2/15/2014)
at least on my f100, it was no problem installing the starter with the drive extended. the only issue was getting that top bolt started. I have ram horns and don't see any added difficulty. But the exhaust isn't installed yet; just the manifolds. What about the idea of just leaving a stud in the top hole and putting a locking (kep) nut on with a wobbly extension?
Short stud works well, just use normal nut and use long 3/8" drive socket extension with pivoty end.
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By lyonroad - 10 Years Ago
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aussiebill (2/15/2014)
vntgtrk (2/15/2014)
mac (2/15/2014)
at least on my f100, it was no problem installing the starter with the drive extended. the only issue was getting that top bolt started. I have ram horns and don't see any added difficulty. But the exhaust isn't installed yet; just the manifolds. What about the idea of just leaving a stud in the top hole and putting a locking (kep) nut on with a wobbly extension? Short stud works well, just use normal nut and use long 3/8" drive socket extension with pivoty end.
I didn't have a stud handy so I ran a bolt in from the back and then replaced it with a regular bolt from the front after securing the other two bolts. Having a stud in the upper hole to hang the starter on at the start helps a lot.
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By mac - 10 Years Ago
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lyonroad (2/15/2014)
aussiebill (2/15/2014)
vntgtrk (2/15/2014)
mac (2/15/2014)
at least on my f100, it was no problem installing the starter with the drive extended. the only issue was getting that top bolt started. I have ram horns and don't see any added difficulty. But the exhaust isn't installed yet; just the manifolds. What about the idea of just leaving a stud in the top hole and putting a locking (kep) nut on with a wobbly extension? Short stud works well, just use normal nut and use long 3/8" drive socket extension with pivoty end. I didn't have a stud handy so I ran a bolt in from the back and then replaced it with a regular bolt from the front after securing the other two bolts. Having a stud in the upper hole to hang the starter on at the start helps a lot.
i did it the hard way and held the starter in position while i started the first bolt. after it was done i realized i could've just threaded a bolt in from the back. oh well.
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