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By '59Edsel - 11 Years Ago
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Hey everyone, I have a 2 speed Mile-O-Matic / Ford-O-Matic / Merc-O-Matic / Cruise-O-Matic from 1959. Just yesterday after running my engine, getting it hot, and running though the gears ford good measure, I noticed a small but steady leak coming from the rear of the transmission. I stopped the engine and investigated. I had just the from of the car on jack stands from this point. There was a good amount of fluid around the pan and its bolts, but it appeared to be coming from the reverse servo cover (driver's side servo cover) I wiped her down and decided to wait until today to see if anything else had seeped. Well, I get under there to look earlier and everything is pretty normal, not dry but nothing out of the usual for this tranny. Maybe just a little seepage from that serve cover. So I decide to jack up the rear end and run her in the air. I start her up and put her in reverse and I get a huge overflow out of the filler tube. I shut her off and wipe everything down / do a little online research / look in my Ford-O-Matic manual and see that causes of this are: aeration of the fluid; coolant in the fluid; and a blocked vent tube. Well, aeration I guess could be a factor. I did just recently do a complete fluid change on the tranny along with a complete empty of the torque converter. But I dunno. Coolant is a definite no because I have an external cooler. And blocked vent is maybe. I eventually did locate the vent tube and cleaned it up with a rag, seemed ok. So after all that, I start her up one last time, all while in the air, and let her run through reverse / drive/ neutral / low / and back to park. I don't get any more overflow through the tube, and that small but steady leak kinda disappeared. I'm going to do a little more investigation this weekend, but I wanted to throw that out there for now and get your guys opinions. Thanks in advance for the help everyone.
Okay, update: I'm starting to think she IS overfilled. The real important thing is it seems my vent is not clogged, the trans overflows out the filler and the vent. Heres what happened. I started my engine, and immediately put the car into reverse, this spewed transmission fluid out of my filler tube. Keep in mind, she's cold at this point. I shut her off, wiped her down and started over. I left it in park and warmed the engine up to full operating temperature. While still in park, I noticed a leak occurring from the transmission vent. I stop the testing there. any insights? I want to add that I added an external transmission cooler, but other than that she' all stock and I'm pretty sure I went by the book in adding the quarts of fluid to the transmission. Maybe I screwed up, I dunno. Where should I go from here? On a side note, I tried to unscrew the vent, no luck. It doesn't have anywhere to put a wrench on it. I used a vice grip, but it just spins and spins. Here's a pic:  |
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By snowcone - 11 Years Ago
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Overfilled is the first thing that comes to mind.
Is the dipstick original?
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By '59Edsel - 11 Years Ago
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I'm pretty sure its the original. Looks like the ones in the manuals and other cars I've seen.
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By rick55 - 11 Years Ago
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as others have said it would suggest that you have too much oil in the trans. Did you drop the oil pan to drain it and did you completely drain the converter.
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By '59Edsel - 11 Years Ago
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Yeah, when I drained it I dropped the pan and completely drained the torque converter. It's weird how it just started doing this though. Last week I took the car on a half hour drive and nothing happened out of the ordinary. Level was just below full and no leaks when that drive was through.
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By '59Edsel - 11 Years Ago
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So I guess I'll drain out a quart tomorrow and see if that makes a difference. If I am getting drain back from the torque converter, does that mean the drain back valve is defective? If so, I'll have to drop the tranny to fix it right?
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By '59Edsel - 11 Years Ago
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Okay, update. I drained out a quart today and ran everything until it was at operating temperature. No leaks present, but now I am not getting a reading on my dipstick. Maybe it isn't original? I'll post a measurement in a bit.
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By '59Edsel - 11 Years Ago
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Looks like the measurement of my dipstick is 17 and 1/2 inches from the top of the riveted metal downward.
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By '59Edsel - 10 Years Ago
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It happened again today after a long hiatus...
My tranny overflowed out of the fill tube. I was revving the engine (While cold) and it overflowed from the fill tube. Hasn't done this for a while. When hot, the dipstick shows the perfect level. Not sure why its overflowing. And yes its the correct dipstick. Maybe it has something to do with revving while cold? |
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By PWH42 - 10 Years Ago
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You,and everyone else on here,are going to think I'm nuts,but I've had 2 FOMs that had that same problem.I cured it by simply putting the dipstick in backwards.I know it makes absolutely no sense,but it works.
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By '59Edsel - 10 Years Ago
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Well, I took your advice. We'll see if it happens again  It's weird that it does it intermittently though...
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By aussiebill - 10 Years Ago
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'59Edsel (11/12/2013)
Looks like the measurement of my dipstick is 17 and 1/2 inches from the top of the riveted metal downward.
Are you checking the dipstick with engine running and trans in park ?
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By '59Edsel - 10 Years Ago
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aussiebill (6/26/2014)
'59Edsel (11/12/2013)
Looks like the measurement of my dipstick is 17 and 1/2 inches from the top of the riveted metal downward.
Are you checking the dipstick with engine running and trans in park ?
Yes, and while everything is nice and hot too
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By '59Edsel - 10 Years Ago
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Does anyone know...
Since my vent tube is completely round with no accommodations for a wrench or a socket, how do I get that thing off? | |
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By MoonShadow - 10 Years Ago
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It's a cap over a tube. I've never removed one but it would seem that if its loose it should be venting. Chuck
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By zuburg - 8 Years Ago
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I've been searching for the answer to a dumb question to no avail. I have a Fordomatic transmission mated to a 239 Y-block in a 1956 Thunderbird (weird, right). Until I pull it, I'm not sure if the tranny came with the 239 or from a Thunderbird. I'm prepping to pull the engine and tranny, but do not see any obvious drain plugs to drain the transmission fluid. Do you have to drop the pan to drain the fluid? If so, how messy is it? I have two different drip pans, but am a little weary to drop a pan if fluid is going to come rushing out all over the place. I'm doing this in my garage. I also have read that there may be two plugs (180 degrees from one another) on the torque converter to allow you to drain it. Is there an access plate somewhere to remove to access those? Pictures would be great if available.
thanks,
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By MoonShadow - 8 Years Ago
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With the dust cover off you should be able to rotate the engine to find those plugs. If you are going to pull the transmission I wouldn't drain the Torque converter until it was out. Much easier. For the pan break all of the bolts loose the remove all but 2 or 3 on a corner. Loosen the gasket all around then put a drain pan under the opposite corner and slowly loosen the last bolts. If you use 3 you can back off the center on a bit then loosen the other two alternating. The opposite corner of the pan will start to drop and most of the fluid will come out. The slower you go the less the mess. Some shops sell an add on drain plug that you could install while the pan is out. Just a matter of drilling a hole for it.
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By zuburg - 8 Years Ago
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I've removed all 14 bolts and the pan is not budging. Should I remove the pipe for the dip stick (which is attached to the side of the pan)? Since this is my first time, I didn't want to damage anything by being too rough trying to get it off. Should I just grab it with some channel locks and pull or pry with a large screw driver? Should I hit it with a hammer to try and loosen it up? By the way, I'm doing this under a car on jack stands, so I don't have a lot of room to work.
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By MoonShadow - 8 Years Ago
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Put enough bolts loosely in each corner to hold the pan then use a putty knife or screwdriver to break the pan loose. It has a gasket that will need to be replaced and you should probably do a filter kit while you have it open. Sometimes a couple of soft whacks with a rubber hammer, or a regular hammer striking a piece of wood, will do it. You can take the large nut loose on the filler tube but it will also be held by a bracket to a upper transmission bolt. The transmission bolts are difficult to start and will probably require several extensions and a universal joint to get off. Sometimes you can see the very top two by looking down the back of the engine at the firewall. Are you suspecting a leak in the front transmission seal? Chuck
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By zuburg - 8 Years Ago
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I decided to use a screwdriver before I read the latest post. I should have put a few of the bolts back. The whole thing dropped down. A little bit messy, but fortunately, the pan dropped straight down and landed on a drip tray I had and the pan stayed about 2/3 full. Now my next chore is to break the nut free that holds the dip stick tube. I've tried a big wrench and hitting with a small hand sledge after soaking with liquid wrench, but no luck yet.
I'm doing all this in prep to pull the engine and transmission. I have a new long block and will have the Tran worked on as well.
I'm thinking it will turn into more work such as new exhaust and some suspension work, unless I run out of money too quickly.
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By MoonShadow - 8 Years Ago
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You should be able to pull the tranny dip stick tube with the engine. It will be a lot easier to manuver with the transmission out. Got luck on the pan drop. I used to end up wearing the fluid. Have you found a shop to go through the transmission yet?
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By dbird - 8 Years Ago
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Zuburg, you mentioned you weren't sure if the trans was original to the engine or 'Bird. Is it water cooled or air cooled, as in are there lines going to the radiator from the trans. My understanding is that most 56's came with water cooled and since the 239 appears to have been discontinued in 56, it would have had an air cooled originally. If it's original to the 'Bird, it should be a three speed, though in normal driving you only use second and third.
Don
1955 Thunderbird, 1956 F100 in progress.
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By zuburg - 8 Years Ago
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Glad to hear I can pull the engine with the Tranny tube attached to the engine as I took the pan with the tube to two different shops to see if they could break the nut loose and neither could, so I don't feel so dumb now. I soaked it with PB Blaster and will let it sit a couple of days and try again. If not, I'll re-attach the pan and tube.
I think I located the speedometer cable attached way back on the housing extension (further back from the cross member). Is that where it is located? It looks hard to get to and it is so gunked up, I can't tell how it is attached. How do you remove the speedometer cable from the tranny?
I don't yet have a transmission shop lined up yet, but I have visited several. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm open. I live in Raleigh, NC if that matters. One place I visited said they would look at it and evaluate what needed to be done for just $90 and give a price, and they have a minimum rebuild charge of $1,000.
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By MoonShadow - 8 Years Ago
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The nut on that tube has possibly been on there since it was new. Be patient and make sure the nut turns free of the tube. I've seen a lot of them get twisted. If you have a heat source you can heat up the nut and spray PB Blaster on it. This will peculate the oil into the threads. Much like soldering copper tubing. The speedometer cable runs to the side of the tail shaft on the drivers side. If crudded up it would look like a round tube entering the transmission at a 90deg angle. There will be one small bolt and a pressure foot that hold it in. Once the bolt is out and the foot pulled back you can pull straight out on the cable. It may be a little tight but it will come out. Possibly you could rotate it a bit to break it loose but be careful not to twist the cable housing. As far as the repair put an ad up in the Classified/wanted section looking for a re-builder that is know to the Y's guys in your area. There are some members down your way that should be able to help.
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By czuch - 8 Years Ago
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The thing you're trying to get off, I think, is a vent.
The whole pan coming down is usually a real mess.
I drilled a 5/16 hole in mine and got a short screw, big washers and a nut. A couple of nylon washers, like on the oil pan, and voila.
Oddly a good hardware store will have everything you need.
I'm doing this all on my 61 Galaxie. Wire wheeling 56 years of crud has been a real ride.
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By Pete 55Tbird - 8 Years Ago
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Hi. Before you go too much further can I give you some thoughts. Try to clean up the outside of the engine,, transmission, frame , cross member NOW. If you can get the car outside and back up on jack stands then put a tarp ( think Harbor Freight) down and pressure wash it as much as you can. Dry. Spray it with Gunk engine cleaner and pressure wash it again.
If the dip stick tube is still attached to the trans pan, I can`t see how you will be able to pull it with the engine if the trans is still in the car.
Watch some Youtube videos about things to help. How to remove stuck nuts, Engine levelers. Any thing else that seems difficult to figure out. It is all there for you to watch. Pete
PS. After the drivers side of the FOM is clean enough to see, look for an oval plate about 3 inch long. This has the FOM ID on it. Look for PMD, PMB thing like that.
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By zuburg - 8 Years Ago
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Thanks, I saw the pressure foot on the speedometer cable today when looking at it. I'll try to clean up the gunk and find the bolt. It looks like it will be easier to get to if I can get the cross member off. I have 4 of the 6 bolts off (I missed 2 of them that were kind of hidden). On the transmission tube, I had two different garages try to get it off, one put some heat on it, but I'm not sure they used enough heat and heated the nut itself. We did use a bunch of PB Blaster. It looks like it should clear, but if it doesn't when we try to pull the engine, I may just have to cut it off and replace it.
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By zuburg - 8 Years Ago
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I have been thinking about whether I can clean the engine bay, frame and underneath the car. Just can't figure out how to do it in my driveway without making such a mess, I might get arrested. I was hoping I could find one of those plastic molded wading pools for kids and putting under the car as I clean it. Not sure if it would work, but maybe with some scrub brushes it would, spray it with Gunk degreaser, and then spray water from a pump sprayer like you use for weeds. It's not high pressure but it would be less volume and maybe easier to manage and catch the run off.
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