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By slumlord444 - 15 Years Ago
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Bought, actualy more like stole, a large input toploader with factory Hurst shifter out of 1970 429 Ford Torino today for $200. Looks good inside. A little normal wear on the dogs on the gears. Plan to have it taken apart and checked out and put in new syncronizers and small parts kit. Will have to change the driveshaft yolk probably. Will definately have to change the clutch disk to fit the large input shaft. Will have to have the hole in the belhousing machined larger so the front snout will fit. Will need larger throwout bearing and retainer. Does anyone know if the clutch fork will work ok with the larger throwout bearing? Am I missing anything in this conversion? I will be installing it in my '57 Tbird. I now have an all syncro 3 speed out of a '64 390 Galaxie in the car. A 4 speed from a 390 would have bolted right in but I could not pass up the large input trans for the price.
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By Ted - 15 Years Ago
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The 1 3/8” input toploader does take a different fork for the throwout bearing than the forks normally used for the smaller input trannies. But these large input tranny forks have been reproduced in recent years and you might try David Kee Toploaders for one. Be sure to get the pivot that goes with it as some of the earlier ‘anti-rattle spring’ style pivot did not work on the original big input forks. David Kee Toploaders Catalog, see page 10 for forks
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By slumlord444 - 15 Years Ago
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Looked at there catalog. nothing specific for the Y block. They have 289 and FE applications. I think I can make my original fit for a lot less money. I have a torch and arc welder. Should not be a problem. I will need a 31 spline front yolk to fit my driveshaft. Any ideas? Kee has one for $75 but I think it uses larger U joints. Any suggestions or will I have to have something made up? If I could find a junkyard yolk I would think any good machinest could cut the two yolks apart and weld them together to make it fit. This is beyond my capailites. It would have to be perfectly straight to work. Unless there is a U joint combination that would work to combine my stock driveshaft with the larger 429 front yolk.
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 15 Years Ago
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There is a U joint that has the smaller size one way and the larger size the other way. I think the original application was Bronco. Any driveshaft shop should be familiafr with them.
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By Ted - 15 Years Ago
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As John mentions, there is a crossover U-Joint with the two different sizes on it to do what you want to do. For a 31 spline yoke for the front of the driveshaft, the C6 trannies use the same yoke as the big input four speeds and although not as common, the smaller U-Joint models can be found on those C6 trannies that had a 352 in front of them. This provides another option. FE and Y-Block throwout bearing forks and pivot point placements in the bellhousings are interchangable as long as maintaining for which tranny input size you are working with. The big input fork for a FE will work in a Y bellhousing as long as the correct pivot point is used so don’t let there not being a specific listing in the replacement catalogs for a Y-Blk stop you in this regard. Have been down the ‘modifying throwout forks’ road and had less than optimum results in a racing environment.
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By Oldmics - 15 Years Ago
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I found it easier to size down the tranny snout on a lathe rather than machine the bell housing. Just my experience.Yours will be a different journey,which after all is part of the fun.  Oldmics
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By mongo - 15 Years Ago
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I used to use these trans. in circle track cars for years. I just saw a cindered iron solid hud clutch disc for that input shaft, may have more too , Davie
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By slumlord444 - 15 Years Ago
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Appreciate the input. Summit has the clutch disk and throwout bearing I need. Still looking for the driveshaft yolk. I know where there is Lincoln sitting abandoned. It may have what I need. I thought there was a U joint that would work! I have been looking at the factory Hurst shifter that came with the trans and a spare T-Bird shifter I have. I have to do some careful measuring but I think I can modify the Hurst so that I can bolt the T-Bird handle on it and use it without modifing it and have it come through the stock shifter tower. David Kee offers Hurst shifters with stock Ford and Mustang 4 speed shifters bolted to them that fit like originals. If he can do it, I think I can do it. Anybody got a spare front yolk?
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By paul2748 - 15 Years Ago
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Oldmics (8/14/2009)
I found it easier to size down the tranny snout on a latherather than machine the bell housing. Just my experience.Yours will be a different journey,which after all is part of the fun. Oldmics
I did the same - much easier
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By Vic Correnti - 15 Years Ago
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I have the same tranny in a 55 bird. I turned the tranny snout to fit the bellhousing and split the fork and rewelded it 25 years ago and abused ever since.
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By slumlord444 - 15 Years Ago
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Sounds like a plan to me. That is exactly what I intend to do. Still looking for a front driveshaft yolk. Got a junkyard nearby that may have one. What are you using for a shifter?
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By Doug T - 15 Years Ago
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I also have a HD big input toploader in my bird. Ditto to turning the bearing retainer and splitting the existing fork. But I welded a piece over the split to stiffen it up While it is apart consider changing to the wide ratio gear set if it isn't wide ratio already. The 2.32 first gear is a little too tall in my book and I think the wide ratio first gear is 2.78 I have had both and much prefer the wider ratio. For a shifter in my Bird I have short lever Hurst mounted in the body floor of the Bird where Ford put their shifters. I could not use the Hurst adaptor to the tailshaft because it is too far forward on the trany and your fist rams the dash going for third. There is a recent interior picture of this in another thread (classifieds, red seat cover) about seat covers and it looks like it was born there. This setup is very tight under the sheetmetal which I didn't want to butcher. But cutting it away and reworking the tunnel would make it easier to work on.
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By slumlord444 - 15 Years Ago
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I understand your thoughts on the gear ratios but my experience with different ratios on 3 speeds many years back tells me to go with the close ratio. I tried 3 speeds with the lower ratio in first but the spread between 2nd and high was too wide. I may have to use a lower rear end ratio to launch it properly. I have an all syncro 3 speed in the car now with a low gear ratio that is about the same as my new 4 speed. Had to launch it at about 5500 rpm with a 3.89 rear end and smal cheater slicks. Hard on parts but the car was tough to catch off the line. A 4.11 or 4.57 would work better. I am going to do some serious measuring and see if I can adapt the Torino Hurst to my T-Bird and bolt or weld on the original shifter handle to come through the original hole in the floor so it will still look "right". Thanks for the input.
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By pegleg - 15 Years Ago
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You're both going to the sameplace via two different routes. Bottom line is it takes a lot of low gear to launch these cars with a small inch Y-Block!
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By charliemccraney - 15 Years Ago
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On most any car 4spd, the spread between 1 and 2 will be much smaller than that of a 3spd. With the wide ratio 4spd, 1st is approximately the same as the 3spd and 4th is the same as 3rd. With the 4 spd, you have one extra gear in between. I would go with a wide ratio so that I can use a taller gear in the rear so that it launches just as hard but does better on the highway.
1 - 4 of my 5 spd are not quite as close as a wide ratio top loader but it was a big difference, compared to the 3 spd.
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