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By ogasman - 3 Years Ago
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Came with a 292 that was supposed to be out of a 1955 bird. Had a 56 block and 57 heads. Is this a 57 distributor?
Thanks
Paul
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 3 Years Ago
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No. It's a '55 T-Bird distributor.
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By Genuinerod - 3 Years Ago
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The number on the distributor should be FEA-12127-E or F for the 55 T- Bird. I think the difference was for manual or auto trans.
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By ogasman - 3 Years Ago
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Thanks Guys
Could not find any casting numbers on the distributor. There is an attached plate with just a few numbers. It came out of a stick car.
Paul
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Looks like a 55 distributor to me. It doesn't have the dual vacuum pot of the 56, but it does have exposed springs found on the 55-56 vacuum-advance-only distributors. It is not a 57 distributor/w both vacuum and mechanical advance. A 57 distributor would not have the exposed springs above the breaker plate.A 55 distributor should have a data/model plate attached to the distributor housing. I think 56 distributors do as well. The information is cast into a 57 distributor's body; there's no plate. A 57 distributor cap will not fit on a 55/56 distributor. If you are going to run a modern 57-up carburetor, you will need a 57-up distributor.
If you can provide the model/part number, one of us can tell you exactly what you have, but it definitely isn't a 57 distributor.
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By ogasman - 3 Years Ago
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The data plate was painted over. Cleaned if off as best as possible. Lower left is stamped 572, top right stamped FEV, lower right stamped E. Just curious why you can't run it with a modern Holley carb? My dad swapped out the teapot intake to the B manifold, and ran a modern Holley carb on his other 1955 bird without any issues that I know of. He did not change the distributor.
Paul
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Go to eatonbalancing.com, click on "Quick Index" at the top of the page, and then select "Modifying the Holley 4000(Teapot) for the late model distributors." I think it will answer your question better than I can.
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By 57RancheroJim - 3 Years Ago
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His situation is the opposite. Later carb and early distributor.
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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57rancherojim, read the article, not just the title.
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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A 57-up carburetor relies on mechanical advance, which the 55 distributor does not have. The 55 vacuum advance is designed to work with the Teapot carburetor. In other words, with a 57-up carburetor and a 55 distributor, he will have no ignition advance. The vacuum advance circuitry can be plugged on a Teapot, thereby relying solely on the mechanical advance of a 57-up distributor, which he does not have. I think it makes more sense when Ted says it, but people who have already figured it out will know what I'm trying to say.
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By charliemccraney - 3 Years Ago
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A modern carb will not provide the correct vacuum signal for that distributor. The result will be that the advance is not controlled even remotely in a correct manner, providing too much advance at times that it is not needed and too little when more is needed. At best, it results in poor performance at the worst, it causes engine damage.
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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The 1953 Ford flathead produced 194 ft lbs and 110 hp. The 1957 Y-block 332 ft lbs and 245 hp (single 4-barrel D code). The 312 produced considerably more horsepower and torque and had a considerably higher compression ratio. Common sense tells me that the carryover flathead Load-o-matic distributor couldn't provide the total amount of advance needed for the later y-blocks to reach their optimal performance and efficiency. An attempt was made to improve the Load-o-matic for the 1956 312 by adding a dual-pot vacuum advance, but still no mechanical advance. When horsepower increased in 1957, the D-code received a larger 4150 Holley carburetor and a new distributor/w both vacuum and mechanical advance.
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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What I would like to see is a modern electronic distributor with tachometer drive ability that will drop in to the '55-'57 Thunderbirds with 12V compatibility. I know there were dual point aftermarket distributors available years ago, but we need an updated modern electronic distributor like the MSD with tach drive. Anyone know of such a dependable distributor available? Dependable. Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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There is. Go to crtperformance.com. You will find the same/similar on ebay as well. You can also have your 57 tach-drive distributor converted by FBO Ignition Systems at www.4secondsflat.com. I have no personal experience with any of them. However, I know someone who has used the CRT in one of his vehicles/w no complaints, and he planned to get another for his T-bird. The CRT/ebay distributor does not have an rpm limiter. The FBO conversion uses Pertronix lll, which does have an adjustable rev limiter. All are self-contained. Pertronix has a remote rev limiter that can be used with Pertronix l and ll and is compatible with other electronic distributors. Again, I have no personal experience with Pertronix, but I will problem use Pertronix ll in my 57 tach-drive distributor, along with their rev/rpm limiter. The CRT is reasonably priced, but you know where it's made. I think that at least some of MSD's products are made there, too.
I'll attempt to contact the guy I know and try to get an update on the CRT distributor.
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By FORD DEARBORN - 3 Years Ago
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What kind of electronic distributor are you referring to? Like, a 57 bird strib capable of driving a mechanical tack and a specific trigger device? I'm probably now a bit behind the times as to the latest and greatest.
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By Ted - 3 Years Ago
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Here’s are a couple of pictures of the CRT ignition distributors for the ’55-’57 Thunderbirds with mechanical tach drive capability and with modern electronics. One picture is the distributor with the conventional cap and the other with a HEI style cap. Here’s are the EBAY links to each of these. The pricing is more than reasonable assuming the quality is good. I’ve not had any of these in the shop yet so I can’t say how good these are yet.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-THUNDERBIRD-V8-TACH-DRIVE-HEI-DISTRIBUTOR-1955-1957-272-292-312-Y-BLOCK/233587968677?fits=Model%3AThunderbird%7CMake%3AFord&hash=item3662ed8aa5:g:REEAAOSwPjNelMYf:sc:ShippingMethodStandard!76655!US!-1
https://www.ebay.com/itm/55-57-Ford-Thunderbird-Y-Block-272-292-Pro-Series-R2R-Distributor-Male-Black-Cap/264670704147?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20201210111314%26meid%3D76101be194f84114917d31ed0e8196fd%26pid%3D101195%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dco%26sd%3D233587968677%26itm%3D264670704147%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv5PairwiseWebWithDarwoV3BBEV2b%26brand%3DCustom&_trksid=p2047675.c101195.m1851
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By FORD DEARBORN - 3 Years Ago
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It probably has no more capabilities than a 57 tach drive distributor with a Pertronix unit installed. However, I bet it's very easy to deal with. I will assume the fly weights are on top of the shaft for easy access and the vacuum unit can be adjusted with an Allen wench. Also, it's a new unit that will have a straight shaft and new bearings. If one doesn't mind the non stock looks then this may be a good deal, that is, if the quality is good. A Pertronix can trigger an external box, MSD 6AL just to name one, for example, if so desired and I will assume the CRT distributor could do that also. The price almost seems too good to be true. Hopefully it proves to be a good reliable distributor.
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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Just ordered one. Will give it a try and see if it works as described. Hopefully the shaft is not for a 302 sbf. Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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JDC, I have to think that there must be a forum member who has the CRT. If not, who is buying them? The fellow I know hasn't responded to email. Let us know how it works out.
My brother had MSD components on his 408 Windsor stroker I/O boat. They were not trouble-free, and they cost considerably more. You don't always get what you pay for. I hope you'll be pleasantly surprised. I am somewhat concerned about longevity, but It seems that I've read there are higher-quality electronic components that will work in the CRT distributor, if you have trouble down the road.
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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I already have two complete MSD systems for my Ys, but they are not tach drive compatible. I am in the process of building a 345Y for my '55 Thunderbird, and would like to keep the tach drive system, at least have the capability to use it if I decide to hook everything up. Joe-JDC
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By 1/8cavman - 3 Years Ago
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I bought one the CRT tach drive distributors in Sept. I didn't install it till early Dec. It looked very well made and seem identical as far as the part that fit into the distributor. It is taller and I got the female type cap. When I road tested my Bird I was very impressed. has more power and ran fine. BUT after I came home and open the hood, I discover the distributor is wobbling a little! The hold down was tight, great, after market crap. Called the seller, too bad I had it too long. After lots of measuring I discovered that the drive gear seems to be is deeper on the shaft and is bottoming out against the block. I am going to space the distributor housing up-away from the block. I am pretty sure this will cure the problem. I am going to put it back in and see if I can put a feeler gauge between the block and the distributor. before I make some shims. I bought some thin metal stock from Hobby Lobby of all places,to make the shims. I'll let you guys know how this works. Ted said he has run into the same problem with FE engines and cured the problem by taking the pin out and drilling a new hole to reposition the gear. This problem does not seem to be that much difference, will see.
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By kevink1955 - 3 Years Ago
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How far off are we talking about, if the gear is installed to low on the shaft it is holding the shaft up and it may not be completely engaging the oil pump drive shaft
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By Ted - 3 Years Ago
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Both Paul and Joe have ordered the CRT distributors. Paul is having his dropped shipped to me and when I receive it, I’ll be measuring the gear location on the shaft to insure it’s not too low thus being in a bind within the engine I plan on testing it in. As a general rule, the MSD distributors for the Y have the gear positioned on the high side so none of those have an interference problem within the block. The gear being a little bit high is not a problem with the MSD distributors but being any shade of too low definitely is. Before sending that CRT distributor back to Paul, I’ll have him measure the distributor cavity in his block to insure that his distributor is also good for his particular block.
Part of the problem with distributor gear placement lies in the block machining as not all the FYB blocks are at that 4.990”or more cavity depth for the distributors. While most are okay, there are those blocks that are machined too shallow on the distributor hole and just being 0.025” less than 4.990” does create a problem with some distributors. Hence the reasoning why MSD intentionally installs their gears on the high side for the FYB. The easy fix is just shim the distributor where it sits on the block with a special shim so it’s raised the appropriate amount. A fix that’s more involved is removing the gear and relocating it to the appropriate spot on the shaft that also coincides with what is needed at the block.
The Ford 351W engines seem to be more prone to the distributor holes in the block being too shallow thus creating premature wear problems when replacement distributors are used. I’ve also come across this same problem with a 460 BBF block but that issue does not appear to be as common as what I find on the 351W engines. The 460 BBF was fixed by just simply shimming the distributor higher. All other engines I have corrected by just relocating the gear on the shaft which does involve drilling new hole for the pin that retains the gear to the shaft.
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By DANIEL TINDER - 3 Years Ago
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Interesting. It hadn’t occurred to me, but I should likely measure the gear location on the 50s NOS Mallory Dual Point that I bought on eBay before installing it. Quality control & machining precision is something that probably couldn’t have been taken for granted 65 yrs. ago.
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By 57RancheroJim - 3 Years Ago
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I think they did better 65 years ago then the Chinese do today.. 
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By FORD DEARBORN - 3 Years Ago
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It will be very interesting to learn what Ted finds once he gets one of these on his operating table. If it has, as I suspect, a ball bearing instead of a sleeve bearing, there may be little or no axial float thus binding when clamped down. Often ball bearings have "some" interference fit. Curious to know if the strib has at least minimum .022" up & down shaft movement and what the distance of the gear installation is? It should be 4.991 to 4.996" bottom of gear to underside of the mounting flange with shaft pushed downward if I'm remembering correctly. If someone has one not installed,, a caliper would provide a good indication. The new strib may be made too precision and therefore not compatible with the manufacturing tolerances of the 50's. Just a thought...............
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By Ted - 3 Years Ago
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Paul sent to me one of the new TSP distributors designed specifically for the ’55-’57 Thunderbirds. The packaging on the supplied box says TSP and not CRT. This distributor is mechanical tach capable. The quality of the parts looks good and some careful measurements of the gear placement on the shaft found it to be 4.983” collapsed and 4.998” extended. The specification within the 1957 Ford service manual calls for the collapsed measurement or pushed up dimension to be 4.991-4.996” with end play being 0.022-0.030”. My experience has shown that the distributor hole measurement should fall anywhere between the extended and collapsed distributor gear measurements. I measured the distributor hole depth in the 312 dyno mule and it is 4.990”. That makes the new TSP distributor correct in its gear measurement as the gear will not be in a bind when installed in the block.
As a FYI, the MSD distributors do have their distributor gears placed higher on the shafts (reduced collapsed measurement) than what’s called for in the Ford manuals but after having dealt with a number of blocks that are machined on the shallow side (not deep enough), I can understand the reasoning for having the gears higher rather than lower on the shafts. Having the gears not running on the distributor pad in the block is not an issue for the MSD distributors. No major issues with the gear being on the high side but any gears that are too low can have some severe wear issues in that area.
The distributor cap on the TSP distributor is ~3/4” higher than the MSD cap so switching the wires from the MSD cap to the CRT cap was not an issue. Both caps in this case incorporated HEI terminals so no problems were encountered in switching the spark plug wires from one cap to the other. With the ignition timing for the CRT distributor set exactly the same as the MSD distributor (39° total), the engine was run on the dyno and it made exactly the same horsepower as the MSD distributor so the electronics are doing their job.
I found no issues with this new distributor so I heartily recommend it to anyone with an early ‘Bird wanting to retain the factory mechanical tachometer. Be forewarned that there are blocks out there with distributor cavities that are on the shallow side and appropriate changes must be made to accommodate those particular blocks. That would involve either relocating the gear higher on the shaft for those shallow holes or a thin shim where the distributor and the block mate up to space the distributor up accordingly.
This particular distributor gets a clean bill of health and will be prepared for use in Paul’s engine.
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By FORD DEARBORN - 3 Years Ago
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Good information, thanks.....................
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Good morning, Ted.
I'm confused by your numbers. There's approximately a 1-inch difference in gear placement between the CRT and the 57 manual specs. Is this a typo?
Thanks
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By Ted - 3 Years Ago
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55blacktie (4/1/2021)
...I'm confused by your numbers. There's approximately a 1-inch difference in gear placement between the CRT and the 57 manual specs. Is this a typo?
Good catch as that was a typo. I’ve gone back into that post and fixed that. Only the inch number changed and not the decimal portion. Thanks for the alert to that.
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Based on their description, I think the CRT and TSP are the same distributor but sold by different vendors. Neither has an adjustable vacuum advance. Is that an issue? CRT's site said that 8mm Packard plug wires also are available. Has anyone purchased them with the distributor? If so, are they a direct fit?
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By Ted - 3 Years Ago
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The TSP distributor that I received does have an adjustable vacuum advance pot. That’s a feature not normally available with the MSD distributors. For dyno testing purposes I used the MSD HEI terminal spark plug wires that were being used with the MSD distributor. The additional ¾” height of the cap posed no problem in installing the wires.
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By DANIEL TINDER - 3 Years Ago
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DANIEL TINDER (2/9/2021)
Interesting. It hadn’t occurred to me, but I should likely measure the gear location on the 50s NOS Mallory Dual Point that I bought on eBay before installing it. Quality control & machining precision is something that probably couldn’t have been taken for granted 65 yrs. ago.
Finally got around to measuring it. Looks like Mallory was also careful to install the gear higher than FoMoCo spec (better too high than too low?). Variation in block machining must have been common knowledge in the late 50s.
BTW: As a side note, while many have stated that their non-vacuum distributor runs just fine, I haven’t read much about the gas mileage that gets sacrificed (?).
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By paul2748 - 3 Years Ago
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I haven't heard much about the insides. Are parts available in case of a problem or, for guys like me, like to carry spare parts?
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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I compared TSP and CRT website descriptions and photos for the Thunderbird mechanical tach-drive distributor. TSP specifically states that their vacuum advance is non-adjustable. On the other hand, CRT confirmed that their vacuum advance is adjustable, and a small allen wrench can be seen in their photo. The CRT is $60 cheaper.
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By ogasman - 3 Years Ago
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Ted said if I didn't care, to get the HEI style cap. He said that the cap / electronics would interchange with MSD pieces. The TSP has the HEI style cap, the CRT has the standard type cap. Ted said the TSP came with an adjustable vacuum advance pot. I paid about $20 bucks more for the TSP than the CRT, EBAY prices.
Paul
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By DANIEL TINDER - 3 Years Ago
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DANIEL TINDER (4/2/2021)
DANIEL TINDER (2/9/2021)
Interesting. It hadn’t occurred to me, but I should likely measure the gear location on the 50s NOS Mallory Dual Point that I bought on eBay before installing it. Quality control & machining precision is something that probably couldn’t have been taken for granted 65 yrs. ago. Finally got around to measuring it. Looks like Mallory was also careful to install the gear higher than FoMoCo spec (better too high than too low?). Variation in block machining must have been common knowledge in the late 50s. BTW/FYI: Was reminded recently that a gear installed too high on the shaft CAN be problematic also. The pitch of the gears will pull the shaft down, eventually destroying the distributor housing, which is why people are warned not to use the distributor gasket included in FelPro kits.
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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Just installed the CRT in my 292 Y that will be going into my '55 Thunderbird. Fired up just fine, no issues so far. Looks nearly stock. The cap is slightly taller due to the electronics inside but at least it looks like the Ford unit to most folks. Joe-JDC  
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Joe, what carburetor is on your engine? Will that spacer allow your air cleaner to clear the hood?
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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Summit 750VS, and it is too small for the engine. Pulling 1.4" vacuum at 6000 rpm @ 402hp. 1" Super Sucker, which will be swapped for another type after a couple more dyno tests. I have a fiberglass Ford bubble hood that I acquired from fellow forum member Gary B. Hopefully that will allow me to try several different intakes in the future similar to the "Awfulhauser" dyno tests. 9.43:1 compression, iron 113 heads, 228* @ .050" on 111 LS, 346 cubic inches. Intended for street cruising. Ted and I took this from a bare block to dyno tested in two days. I thoroughly enjoyed working with Ted again on a Y. I am still recuperating from the long hours. LOL.       Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Impressive! You must have done some serious port work on those 113 heads. How about that windage tray? You had a top-notch guy to work with. I'm envious.
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By DANIEL TINDER - 3 Years Ago
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Joe,
What intake manifold (can’t tell from photo)? Modified ‘B’, or Blue Thunder?
BTW: Just wondering, are BTs for the ‘Y’ still available?
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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Yes, I reworked the heads myself. Ported the BT version 5 with firing order on it. The BT intakes are still available, but have had a price increase. We did the windage tray modification to the EMC 303 Y, and now this 346 Y. It is a 289 SBF windage tray. I ordered the 351W studs for 1/2" mains, and Ted milled the mounting slots to the width of the Y mains, a couple of cuts with a cut off wheel, and it fits quite well. You will have to cut a small amount to clear the pick-up tube, but not a big issue. Dip stick clears with no issues, either. I kept the compression low on purpose so that it would be pump gas friendly. I am glad you had a hard time determining what intake was on the engine, since painting it makes it look like the original Ford, I had another BT, but it doesn't have the firing order on it. Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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228 @ .050/w 111 LSA sounds like Mummert's cam. Did you use a C2OE block? What transmission and rear gears? Yes, the BT intake is expensive.
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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Have a T-5, adapter, but after seeing 395 fb/ft, I may go with a TKO and stock rear gears. The Bird has 3 speed OD, so deep gears right now. Yes, it is one of the Mummert camshafts that I ordered several years ago. I am using the Harland Sharp rocker arms for iron heads. Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Just to be safe, makes sense to go with a transmission that has a higher torque rating than the T-5. Still wondering if you used a C2AE block. With 5.5 lbs. fuel pressure, which fuel pump? I've seen lots of complaints about both mechanical and electrical pumps. My Carter M6903 FE pump is still in the box. Is there a better mechanical pump? No vacuum accessories.
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By Cliff - 3 Years Ago
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GOOD JOB, 400HP with a little cam and no compression is hard to do, and looks to me like there's more
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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Dnyo cell electric fuel pump with regulator. Yes, C2 block, early one(K) actually late '61 casting. We didn't have time to actually start tuning such as jets, spacers, different valve lash, timing, or different carb or manifold. I have the FPA T-Bird headers also that I would like to get a couple of pulls with. At 75, I was tuckered after two days full speed, and I know Ted was tired, too. I am really appreciative of how Ted works with me and I am still learning Y's even though I started with a Y back in '62. We dyno tested a near stock 428 CJ of mine a few months ago, and it only made 377 hp. I am always amazed how well these little Ys respond to typical hop-up modifications. Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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Knowing what it takes, you didn't accomplish it with your loose change, and there's more than just 1 cu. in. difference between a 427 and 428; but you know that.
Thanks for sharing all the info.
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By cos - 3 Years Ago
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Hi Joe I'm really interested in your build. Would really like to get details you did to this engine, everything. Would you consider sharing it here or new post? Bill Oregon
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By Joe-JDC - 3 Years Ago
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I was hoping to get the build featured in Y Block Magazine with all the pertinent details. If that is not possible, then yes, I will give all the details here for everyone to see. Joe-JDC
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By 55blacktie - 3 Years Ago
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That would be incentive for me to subscribe!
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By 55blacktie - Last Year
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Joe, I sent a PM before finding this (I forgot about it). Once the engine was installed in your 55 Tbird, were there any clearance issues with the CRT distributor?
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