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By MattW - 6 Years Ago
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I'd like to clean the sludge out of the bottom of my oil pan and need to drop the pan. I don't know for sure if there is sludge but I want to make sure and clean if needed. I have a Ford shop manual and have done everything it mentions- all cap screws and 4 nuts removed, pickup tube nut at pump suction loosened (that end of the tube is free), nut loosened on the other end of the tube at the pan and #5 cylinder at TDC. The pan is loose and free from the four studs where the nuts fasten but will not come out. The bottom of the pan is contacting the chassis cross member- if the pan could come down a little further it would probably come out if it wasn't for the cross member. I hate to put the pan back on with the old gasket- the pan is really not far enough down for me to remove the old gasket. Anybody have any experience with oil pan removal on a car like this? Thanks!
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By oldcarmark - 6 Years Ago
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Turn the Engine over by Hand until #1 is at TDC. That puts the Crank Throw in the up Position. Right now that is blocking Pan removal. You can also undo Motor Mounts from Frame and raise the Engine and put blocks in the Mounts to give a few more Inches if You still find it Tight.The front Anti Sway Bar can also be a Pain if U can't quite get the Pan out. I ended up taking it off although I never raised the Engine which might have been enouugh.
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By MattW - 6 Years Ago
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OK I'll give those things a try. Thanks for the help!
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By Talkwrench - 6 Years Ago
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I thought it was no. 6 TDC ? its a bit of a wiggle but you will get it and youre doing the right thing by checking for sludge etc , you can do your screen as well.
Check your pan for being straight. just use contact cement to glue the gasket to the pan when re-installing, put a bit of [white] grease on the top of the gasket and some non hardening around the areas that will meet the split in the timing cover and rear . Dont over tighten and that means the jamb nut too!
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By oldcarmark - 6 Years Ago
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Talkwrench (11/8/2018)
I thought it was no. 6 TDC ? its a bit of a wiggle but you will get it and youre doing the right thing by checking for sludge etc , you can do your screen as well. Check your pan for being straight. just use contact cement to glue the gasket to the pan when re-installing, put a bit of [white] grease on the top of the gasket and some non hardening around the areas that will meet the split in the timing cover and rear . Dont over tighten and that means the jamb nut too!
I found an old Post that said #1 at TDC. Is #1 correct? Anyone know?
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By darrell - 6 Years Ago
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brings back some memories i remember laying on my back when i was 16 taking the base of a 56 merc.didnt know anything about turning the motor over but it came right of so guess i got lucky.
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By DryLakesRacer - 6 Years Ago
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My 1956 Ford manual says #5 TDC. and I was able to remove the pan coming forward under the steady rest. The only problem I had was the steady rest bolts. I did not put the bolts back on when I replaced the pan. I took the bolts up from he bottom an did not put nuts on them. just left them in as guides
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By oldcarmark - 6 Years Ago
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darrell (11/8/2018)
brings back some memories i remember laying on my back when i was 16 taking the base of a 56 merc.didnt know anything about turning the motor over but it came right of so guess i got lucky.
Brings back Memories of laying on my Back taking the Pan off my 56 To fix rear Main Leak. I was 61 not 16.and that was only a Couple of Years ago.Get's Old Quickly. LOL!!!
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By MoonShadow - 6 Years Ago
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While the pan is off use a socket and ball peen hammer to flatten the bolt holes in the flange. They are most likely dimpled in. Using the socket for support tap on the bottom side of the hole. Even if they pop out the other way they will renew the clamping area and not damage the new gasket.
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By MattW - 6 Years Ago
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I finally got the oil pan out. I really appreciate everyone's suggestions and help. I loosened the nuts on the engine mounts, the bolts on the driveshaft collar just behind the transmission, the steady rest ground cable and the one bolt under the steady rest. I was able to put a 6" or so long 2x4 under the steady rest and on top of the steady rest support and let the engine back down on the wood. I tried to get the pan out without raising the engine with #1 cylinder at TDC and then #5 cylinder at TDC without success.
The oil pan had about 3/8 of an inch of sludge in the bottom and the screen, although open, was dirty too. The crankshaft and timing chain have a coating of sludge on them- not too bad but not very clean either. I will gunk and pressure wash these areas. I had my valve covers off about 2 years ago and the valve trains were very clean so I was surprised to see the crankshaft/timing chain not nearly as clean- 40,000 miles on the engine. Does this engine have any high heat issues (hot spots) that would cause the oil to sludge up like this?
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By 2721955meteor - 6 Years Ago
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while you have the pan off check for sludge under the bafle at the rear of the pan. it is a real trap for slug and tough to clean.
i recently had to cut the bafle and bend to get that aria clean,of coarse re weld the bafle. with modern oils you will elevate further sludge
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By KULTULZ - 6 Years Ago
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'Does this engine have any high heat issues (hot spots) that would cause the oil to sludge up like this?"
Usually caused by inadequate crankcase ventilation, excessive blow-by, lack of service and improper oil usage (non and low detergents, especially back in the day).
When you put it back together, watch oil pressure and change the filter a few times. Of course what is knocked loose will go to the pump first.
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By Ted - 6 Years Ago
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MattW (11/9/2018)
......The oil pan had about 3/8 of an inch of sludge in the bottom and the screen, although open, was dirty too. The crankshaft and timing chain have a coating of sludge on them- not too bad but not very clean either. I will gunk and pressure wash these areas. I had my valve covers off about 2 years ago and the valve trains were very clean so I was surprised to see the crankshaft/timing chain not nearly as clean- 40,000 miles on the engine. Does this engine have any high heat issues (hot spots) that would cause the oil to sludge up like this?
You can blame the quality of the oil and/or the lack or regular oil changes for the crankcase area sludge buildup. Regarding the lack of sludge or buildups under the valve covers, I suspect that the heads have been off and/or serviced sometime in the past.
The problem with low mileage engines is they get serviced on a mileage interval and not a time interval. As a result, you have the sludge buildups and accelerated engine wear that results from having oxidized/contaminated oil in place much of the time. A good rule of thumb for cars not driven often is to just change the oil once per year regardless of miles driven.
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By oldcarmark - 6 Years Ago
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MattW (11/9/2018)
I finally got the oil pan out. I really appreciate everyone's suggestions and help. I loosened the nuts on the engine mounts, the bolts on the driveshaft collar just behind the transmission, the steady rest ground cable and the one bolt under the steady rest. I was able to put a 6" or so long 2x4 under the steady rest and on top of the steady rest support and let the engine back down on the wood. I tried to get the pan out without raising the engine with #1 cylinder at TDC and then #5 cylinder at TDC without success. The oil pan had about 3/8 of an inch of sludge in the bottom and the screen, although open, was dirty too. The crankshaft and timing chain have a coating of sludge on them- not too bad but not very clean either. I will gunk and pressure wash these areas. I had my valve covers off about 2 years ago and the valve trains were very clean so I was surprised to see the crankshaft/timing chain not nearly as clean- 40,000 miles on the engine. Does this engine have any high heat issues (hot spots) that would cause the oil to sludge up like this?
Thought I would ask what Oil are You currently using in this Engine? We might be able to make some Recommendations.
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By darrell - 6 Years Ago
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theres anywhere from 4 to 6 or 7 spot welds holding the baffle in place if theres crap under it you cant get it out.you can take it somewhere and have it cleaned or in my case i use a chisel and cut them of clean it up and mig it back on.in the end its easier to have it cleaned but theres no place close to me.
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By MattW - 6 Years Ago
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On the oil question I have just been using mineral oil 10W-30. No particular brand- I just make sure it has the latest API ratings- currently SN, SM, SL, ILSAC GF-5. This car has really not been driven since 1975. I had the car on jacks at my Mother's house in a garage about an hour and half away- I would crank it every 6 weeks or so. I did not change the oil and filter every year- more like every two years. A little history- my Dad bought the car for me in 1973 from a relative (paid $165 for it) with 38,000 miles on the odometer. The car had been sitting in their garage for a while but it ran very well. I drove it 3 years from '73 to '75 and used Quaker State (I think) with a good dose of STP at every oil change- as I mentioned in the original post the odometer reads a little over 40,000 miles now. The car is finally in my garage now (as of this past Tuesday) so I can drive it and maintain it better. I've always worked on it over the years- painting, cleaning, lubrication, etc. but it stayed on the jack stands. I will check out the crankcase ventilation to make sure everything there is OK. What about switching to synthetic for the engine, transmission and rear end or should I start using a better mineral based oil? BTW- The gunking and hot water pressure washing of the crankshaft, timing chain and valves turned out good. All the buildup that was there is gone- what I can see anyway. The valves were much cleaner than the crankshaft- they got gunked and washed too.
When I get it started again I'm thinking about an engine flush- like Sea Foam- just to remove what loose sludge is probably still hanging on that I couldn't reach. Would you recommend that? Thanks.
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By MattW - 6 Years Ago
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I gunked and pressure washed the underside of the oil pan baffle- thru the two holes on the end of the baffle. I think I got it clean but I'll recheck it. THX.
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By Dobie - 6 Years Ago
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"What about switching to synthetic for the engine, transmission and rear end or should I start using a better mineral based oil?"
I would stay away from synthetic, the reason being these engines weren't sealed as well as modern engines. Synthetic has a knack for finding leak points regular oil can't. Also, most synthetics don't have the zinc & phosphorus in levels needed for flat tappet engines. You've been adding STP which is good as it does have a lot of zinc and phosphorus. I guess you could add it to synthetic but you'd still have the leak issue. If you have a manual transmission the only proper oil is straight mineral oil, non-hypoid. Hypoid oils have additives that will attack any yellow metal in the transmission, i.e., the synchronizers. Tractor Supply has the proper stuff, look for Ford Tractor Transmission Oil. The diff isn't as picky as long as you use hypoid oil of the proper weight. I'd stay away from synthetic there, too because of the potential leak issue. JMHO, others' opinions may differ.
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By Ted - 6 Years Ago
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MattW (11/10/2018)
......What about switching to synthetic for the engine, transmission and rear end or should I start using a better mineral based oil?
Ditto on the previous comments about synthetic oils as most should be avoided on the older flat tappet equipped engines. With flat tappet camshafts, you need an engine oil with sufficient shear properties to assist the rotation of the lifters on the lobes. For this reason, always use oil with at least 30W in its weight classification.
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By oldcarmark - 6 Years Ago
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I use Rotella-T 15w40. Designed for the Flat Tappet Type Engines. Others will offer up their Preferences.
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By MattW - 6 Years Ago
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The Rotella mineral oils seem to be used by people who take care of their cars/tractors etc. so I'll try that for the '56. I'll also get the tractor transmission oil for the transmission and stay with the hypoid on the rear end. Thanks!
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By oldcarmark - 6 Years Ago
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Its not Mineral Oil. Conventional Oil used in many Diesel Engines . It has additives not found in most Conventional Oil. Walmart Sells it for One Example.
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By Dobie - 6 Years Ago
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I know a lot of guys use diesel motor oil for the zinc/phosphorus content but be sure to research and find the proper one. Refiners have been lowering the zinc/phosphorus in diesel oils, too, since late model diesel engines have catalytic converters. Also, I'm concerned that the detergent package in diesel oil may be too harsh for gas engines over the long term. I used it a few times in my Merc after I bought the car. It turned black very quickly so I'm guessing it dissolved a lot of deposits, I use a conventional oil for high mileage engines and add a bottle of STP when I change it. So far so good.
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By DryLakesRacer - 6 Years Ago
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The tag on the inside of the glove box stated 20-20W as the correct oil. I had been using 10-30 and a Wix filter for the first 6 years I've owned my 56. I've now gone to 5-20 and have seen a marked improvement of oil under the rocker arm covers. I do add 1/2 bottle of Lucas Stabilzer with added ZDDP that's not supposed to separate. I do not know if any revisions were made to the center cam bearing feed or not, but I do like the lighter oil. I drive about 2000 miles a year exclusively in town on the weekends and change oil once a year.
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By MoonShadow - 6 Years Ago
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When the 56 was built multiple viscosity oils were not readily available. So we ran one weight for summer and another for winter. In the fall we changed the thermostat and the oil as part of the winter prep. Lots of the things we take for granted now are "new stuff". It makes our lives easier.
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By paul2748 - 6 Years Ago
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Ted Eaton has mentioned a few times that he does not recommend Rotella or any diesel oil. I notice that he seems to go with 10-40 Valvoline conventional in the engines he builds.based on his articles in Y-Block Magazine
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By 2721955meteor - 6 Years Ago
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rotela t is designed for newer diesel engines that have roller cams and use low sulphur fuel along with emission controls.
on the 5galon pails used in canada they state not for gas engines especially flat tappet. reason is it results early cam lobe wear.
but if the guys at the coffee shop say its ok must be ok. Rotella t is a excellent oil if used in modern diesel engines
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By MoonShadow - 6 Years Ago
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Rotella also changed their oil to lower the Sulphur emissions. I bought a few cases years ago but have used them up now. I think they may still offer a higher Sulphur version but I'm not sure what it is. On Ted's recommendation for my new(est) engine I'm running Valvoline Racing oil 20-50. To me Ted is the shortcut to an answer without research. Thank you Ted for doing it for me!
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