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By newbill - 7 Years Ago
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I am having difficulty installing a new Airtek (wish I held off ordering a while so that I would have seen the previous post about Airtek poor quality) dual diaphragm fuel pump on my 1956 292. I am aware of the necessity of rotating the engine so that the eccentric is at its uppermost position and I have done that. However, I still can't raise the fuel pump high enough so that I can get the bolts started. Is there a trick I'm missing here? Pertaining to Airtek poor quality, does anyone know of a better quality brand that is dual diaphragm? I rebuilt my vacuum wiper motor a while back and it works very well. I prefer not to go to electric wipers just so I can run a single diaphragm pump.
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By paul2748 - 7 Years Ago
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Even with the eccentric in its uppermost position, I have always had to manually push on the pump to get it to line up with the bolt holes. Nature of the beast, I guess.
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By 62bigwindow - 7 Years Ago
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The first one I put in was almost too easy. The spring on the action arm gave almost no resistance. The second was so tight I almost needed a second hand. I'm sure the position of the cam was a small factor. I'd suggest getting a couple bolts that are a lot longer and cut the heads off. Use them as guide pins. Should help a little.
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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newbill (6/26/2018)
I am having difficulty installing a new Airtek (wish I held off ordering a while so that I would have seen the previous post about Airtek poor quality) dual diaphragm fuel pump on my 1956 292. I am aware of the necessity of rotating the engine so that the eccentric is at its uppermost position and I have done that. However, I still can't raise the fuel pump high enough so that I can get the bolts started. Is there a trick I'm missing here? Pertaining to Airtek poor quality, does anyone know of a better quality brand that is dual diaphragm? I rebuilt my vacuum wiper motor a while back and it works very well. I prefer not to go to electric wipers just so I can run a single diaphragm pump.
Spectra SP1285MP Brand new Pump. I just ordered an Airtex from Rock Auto before reading Post also. I will be sending it back. it's good to hear others experiences with these types of Parts. Wonder if they are made "Offshore"? Anyone know?
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By 62bigwindow - 7 Years Ago
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I'm sure they are. The second one I bought was rebadged as a Carter. Identical in appearance and same problems.
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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From what I've been reading in some of the forums the imported pumps are notorious for excessive fuel pressure. For most of us 3-4 psi is plenty.
Somebody mentioned that the addition of an extra gasket or two as required can be used to fine tune fuel pump pressure.
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By newbill - 7 Years Ago
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With the new Airtex pump sitting on the bench, it takes something like 5 times more force to depress the lever than the old one does. There is no way you could overcome this force and raise the pump so the bolt holes would align. Maybe a jack from underneath would work. However, I'm thinking that the spring inside the pump which gives resistance to the lever is related to the fuel pressure output of the pump. Stiffer spring - higher pressure. The 1956 Ford shop manual calls for 4 to 5 psi pressure. Excessive pressure would cause the carburetor float valves not to seat which would lead to flooding. I'm running the original "teapot" carb. I'm going to try to send the Airtex pump back for a refund.
The question is - what to do now?
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By 62bigwindow - 7 Years Ago
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Rebuild the old one. There not complicated at all. Document items as you pull it apart and you'll be fine.
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By 57RancheroJim - 7 Years Ago
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Spectra pump from Summit $154 from Amazon $130
I wish ALL suppliers would be required to state the origin of their parts, a few do but not many...
NewBill, I I've installed 3 Airtex, the first two leaked and didn't experience any issue with high spring pressure to make instillation difficult..
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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57RancheroJim (6/27/2018)
Spectra pump from Summit $154 from Amazon $130 I wish ALL suppliers would be required to state the origin of their parts, a few do but not many... NewBill, I I've installed 3 Airtex, the first two leaked and didn't experience any issue with high spring pressure to make instillation difficult..
I emailed Spectra out of curiousity regarding Origin of this Fuel Pump. Made either in USA or Mexico but assured Me they are made to High Standards either Location. These are New not Exchange Units.
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By newbill - 7 Years Ago
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I performed a bench test on the new Airtex pump this afternoon to test for pressure. It's 5 psi, which is exactly what is needed for the 1956 292 "teapot" carburetor. I also compared the actuator arm location of the old and new pump. They are both the same relative to the mounting holes. My last ditch effort to install it is to stab the pump with the flange contacting the engine (the mounting holes in pump will be too low to get the bolts started). Then place a small jack underneath and overcome the high arm resistance to raise the pump so the holes align. However, according to 57RancheroJim's experience with these Airtek pumps, I'm wondering if it's worth the effort.
62BigWindow: I tried the "guide bolt" (longer bolts with cut off heads), but the bottom of the pump must be tilted up so that the arm tilts down in order to go under the eccentric. As far as rebuilding my old pump, I've heard that re-staking the new valves is a tricky process. Have you found that to be true? Also, can you recommend an ethanol resistant kit?
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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.If its that difficult to install because of extreme arm Pressure I would not suggest using it. You should be able to work the Arm with the Pump standing up on the Workbench before installing it. There is no way it should be that difficult to Install. What affect do You think that Pressure will have on the Cam Lobe if You do get it installed? I assume You are trying to install it UNDER the Camshaft-not on Top?
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By 57RancheroJim - 7 Years Ago
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I too wouldn't use a pump with that much spring pressure. After the first two that leaked the third one has been on for a little over 8,000 miles and still working but I wouldn't use another one in the future.
Airtex is a huge supplier of pumps for OE on cars and trucks, maybe it was just bad luck I got two bad ones but I'm not impressed with the ones they make for Y blocks..
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By 62bigwindow - 7 Years Ago
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http://www.74tr6.com/fuelpump.htm
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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I picked this up a while back. Isn't there supposed to be a paper element filter cartridge and a spring included with these? There is a brass screen in the top. It was rebuilt at one time, but I doubt it would last long with modern gasoline.
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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Some of these Glass Bowl Ones are referred to as "Sediment Bowl" Pumps. The Brass Screen filters out any large pieces.. They still require an inline Filter before the Carb. If its an old rebuilt Unit it won't last long with Modern Gas. I see all these NOSR Pumps on Ebay all the Time. I wouldn't touch One unless its a newer rebuilt Unit. The old Diaphrams won't last with Today's Gas.
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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Yes, it does have a brass screen at the top, I thought they were supposed to have had a filter inside. Hm.
Are modern replacement diaphragms available anywhere that will tolerate the stuff they call gasoline?
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By 62bigwindow - 7 Years Ago
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http://www.then-now-auto.com/
Try these guys. Great to work with and I was told they mold their own rubber seals.
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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Woah! Exactly what I were looking fer. Thanks
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By Gene Purser - 7 Years Ago
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The guys over on the flathead forum recommend Daytona Parts for the ethanol resistant kits
https://daytonaparts.com/?gclid=Cj0KCQjwjtLZBRDLARIsAKT6fXySK4wA6299TR4xPnSw69ppTrCkmWvRfmdZhwIFq2LIeRQzzawbgyIaAmedEALw_wcB
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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Gene, those are carburetor kits near as I can tell. Do they have fuel pump kits?
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By 57RancheroJim - 7 Years Ago
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I just replaced the fuel pump on my 223 six and it claimed to be Ethanol fuel compatible. I'm hoping the Airtex on my Y is also but who knows.
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By HT32BSX115 - 7 Years Ago
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Howdy all,
I replaced the mechanical fuel pump on my Mercruiser 454 V-8 in 2006 with an Airtex pump (the Mercruiser OEM btw)
All it's ever had is E10 fuel. It still runs just fine. I think you may find that Airtex is the OEM for many fuel pumps out there in radio land......
I would I would think that anyone with a defective Airtex pump simply got a defective pump. That doesn't make them all defective IMHO.....
When I buy the new pump for my 292, if I don't go to an electric, it'll be an Airtex.
73/Rick
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By Gene Purser - 7 Years Ago
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Tedster (6/28/2018)
Gene, those are carburetor kits near as I can tell. Do they have fuel pump kits?
I thought they had fuel pump parts, but apparently not. I apologize.
I have sent an email to another source, I'll let you know when I hear from him.
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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Not a problem, I'm always amazed at the websites that are out there that you guys know about, they just don't seem to pop up in the intertube search motors anymore the way they once did. They went from "most relevent" to "most $$$" some years ago.
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By newbill - 7 Years Ago
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oldcarmark, One of the first things I did after receiving the Airtex pump was to place it on the bench and work the arm. As I mentioned earlier, the force required to depress the arm seemed like roughly five times that of the old pump. It did occur to me that this much force could damage the eccentric on the cam (as well as possible accelerated wear on the front cam bearing). However everything is relative and this arm force, although difficult to overcome by hand, is much less than that caused by a single valve spring. Yes, the arm was under (not on top of) the eccentric. Also, the eccentric was placed at its uppermost position by rotating the engine . I did not have any trouble re-installing the old pump as well as an extra used pump I have. Both of these pumps had much less arm force than the Airtek. The old pump I had in the car was presenting fuel starvation on heavy acceleration or speed above 60. I tested it before removing it and it tested 5 psi (normal), but only about half the specified flow rate. This is what's so puzzling. It seems like the pump pressure would be relative to the diaphragm spring stiffness. Both the old pump and the Airtek tested at 5 psi, yet the Airtek pump has much more resistance at the arm.
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By Gene Purser - 7 Years Ago
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Gene Purser (6/29/2018)
Tedster (6/28/2018)
Gene, those are carburetor kits near as I can tell. Do they have fuel pump kits? I thought they had fuel pump parts, but apparently not. I apologize. I have sent an email to another source, I'll let you know when I hear from him.
My flathead pump and carb rebuilder responded:
"I can make a diaphragm for your pump if you send me the old one. I salvage the stem and washers and reuse them with my viton discs. That's about it for non flathead pumps."
I can send you his contact info if you are interested.
Gene
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By Tedster - 7 Years Ago
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I appreciate the offer Gene, it's something on the back burner tho definitely not a priority. On a whim after you mentioned it, I looked on eBay, at Viton sheet. Then, I found a whole passle of fuel pump rebuild kits, supposedly made with ethanol tolerant materials. These rebuild kits are about double the cost of an FE pump with filter, n order to install the old style pump have to probably rebend fuel line, install an inline filter, and then add the cost of the kit, etc. Heck with all that. Must be gettin' old!
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By 30 coupe - 7 Years Ago
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I would not use a pump that I could not install with just one hand pushing up on the pump and the other installing one of the bolts. As far as the fuel pumps with the glass sediment bowls are concerned , some are designed for use with a filter and some are just a sediment bowl with the screen. I have seen both, but can not say as to what either one came on originally. I am using a 390 FE pump on my y-block with 3 '94 carbs, and a 428 pump for my yet to be installed 313 C.I. 2x4 y-block..
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By oldcarmark - 7 Years Ago
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newbill (6/29/2018)
oldcarmark, One of the first things I did after receiving the Airtex pump was to place it on the bench and work the arm. As I mentioned earlier, the force required to depress the arm seemed like roughly five times that of the old pump. It did occur to me that this much force could damage the eccentric on the cam (as well as possible accelerated wear on the front cam bearing). However everything is relative and this arm force, although difficult to overcome by hand, is much less than that caused by a single valve spring. Yes, the arm was under (not on top of) the eccentric. Also, the eccentric was placed at its uppermost position by rotating the engine . I did not have any trouble re-installing the old pump as well as an extra used pump I have. Both of these pumps had much less arm force than the Airtek. The old pump I had in the car was presenting fuel starvation on heavy acceleration or speed above 60. I tested it before removing it and it tested 5 psi (normal), but only about half the specified flow rate. This is what's so puzzling. It seems like the pump pressure would be relative to the diaphragm spring stiffness. Both the old pump and the Airtek tested at 5 psi, yet the Airtek pump has much more resistance at the arm.
I would suggest You call Airtex Customer Service Tech Line. If You google Airtex Customer Service they have a 1-800 #. I would be interested to know what they tell You. I just got an Airtex Pump from Rock Auto like the One You have. Debating if I should to pay the return Cost and lose the Shipping Cost I paid or take a Chance and keep it.
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